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stangman39
02-06-2008, 11:39 AM
Hi all,
I have a Curve 8310 and love it. I have AT&T with the unlimited data plan etc. My girlfriend has the Blackberry World Edition and has Verizon with the data plan.
I was under the impression that using the Blackberry Messenger installed on our phones setup thru our PIN this was a free service to anyone who had a Blackberry. Well, my g/f sent me a msg this am all upset saying she got hit with $400 in charges from Verizon since they look at Blackberry Msnger messages like text msgs!!

Can someone shed some light on this confusion for me.

Thanks!
Mike

penguin3107
02-06-2008, 11:50 AM
PIN messages are data. BlackBerry messenger uses PIN messagins... so it's also data.
Verizon absolutely does NOT treat PIN messages as text messages... so your G/F if misunderstanding or misreading her bill.

Maybe the $400 in overage charges are from text messages sent to someone else... not you. They certainly arent the result of BlackBerry Messenger or PIN messaging.

MrKyoo
02-06-2008, 11:53 AM
...Maybe the $400 in overage charges are from text messages sent to someone else... not you. They certainly arent the result of BlackBerry Messenger or PIN messaging.I hope for stangman39 case that it's not this.

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:02 PM
Thanks all!! This is totally what I thought...about the messages being sent thru PIN and PIN msgs shouldn't act like text msgs.
Let me just make sure I am clear...I didn't need to download anything special to use the Blackberry Messenger...it was already installed on my homescreen of my Curve and I just added contacts by adding their PIN to their contact info in the address book.

Regarding the g/f sending messages to someone else....that would sure be interesting but I am not thinking down that patch just yet.

Also...since PINs are data...as long as the g/f has an unlimited data plan...she shouldn't be charged extra. Could she possible not have an unlimited data plan?? Could that explain the added charges?

Mike

Thatzmister2u
02-06-2008, 12:06 PM
Did your GF add you to her messenger list using your PIN number? Steps are
add address book entry for you, enter your PIN in the address book entry and then add your address book entry from the BB Messenger. If she had an Email address listed at the time instead of a PIN number it might be considered email or text I don't know. That's all I can think of... sorry to hear
about the bill. Ouch!

E-

As far as her plan. I don't think she could send a true PIN message without a BB data plan. But I would have her call the carrier to confirm.

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 12:07 PM
she might be dropped on VZW if she exceeds 5gb of data usage per month, but to do this using PIN messaing would be near impossible. $400 in text message is still WAY over, i would think it has to be something with using more voice minutes than she is alloted

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:11 PM
Did you GF add you to her messenger list using your PIN number? Steps are
add address book entry for you, enter your PIN in the address book entry and then add your address book entry from the BB Messenger. If she had an Email address listed at the time instead of a PIN number it might be considered email or text I don't know. That's all I can think of... sorry to hear
about the bill. Ouch!

E-

As far as her plan. I don't think she could send a true PIN message without a BB data plan. But I would have her call the carrier to confirm.

I am almost 100% positive she added me using my PIN b/c I walked her thru the process. She didn't even know what BB Msnger was b4 she met me!

Mike

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:15 PM
Hey Penguin,

I see it looks like you have customized your PIN. How did you do that?

Thanks,
Mike

Thatzmister2u
02-06-2008, 12:21 PM
Hey Penguin,

I see it looks like you have customized your PIN. How did you do that?

Thanks,
Mike

Stangman,

Click on User CP on this page and edit Options, it's the last field on the screen. What ever you put there shows up on your posts.

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:23 PM
Are you all 100% sure that BB Msnger works thru PIN and the msgs shouldnt be counted as text msgs? I have another friend who is on Verizon and she is claiming if you are not BB Msnging from Verizon to Verizon they act as text msgs.
Maybe we need someone who has Verizon to chim in! Seems most of us in this thread have AT&T. Maybe I just need to call Verizon! (My friend said she called Verizon and they told her if you are BB Msging someone outside of the Verizon network they count them as text msgs...)

Thanks,
Mike

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 12:24 PM
your friend is completely mistaken. BB messages only use the carrier network to get to the RIM network, that is all. They are just data packets, not SMS. SMS uses the voice network, PIN uses data.

penguin3107
02-06-2008, 12:25 PM
Are you all 100% sure that BB Msnger works thru PIN and the msgs shouldnt be counted as text msgs?
Maybe we need someone who has Verizon to chim in!

130% sure.
I don't need to personally use Verizon Wireless to know this.
Many of us support much more than our own devices in corporate environments.

Dawg
02-06-2008, 12:27 PM
Are you all 100% sure that BB Msnger works thru PIN and the msgs shouldnt be counted as text msgs? I have another friend who is on Verizon and she is claiming if you are not BB Msnging from Verizon to Verizon they act as text msgs.
Maybe we need someone who has Verizon to chim in! Seems most of us in this thread have AT&T. Maybe I just need to call Verizon!

Thanks,
Mike

Trust us they are data they go through rims servers not vzw they have nothing to do with PIN messaging. PIN 100% data cant send a PIN with out a BB data plan. PIN messaging doesnt even work with out a BB data plan.

Thatzmister2u
02-06-2008, 12:27 PM
Are you all 100% sure that BB Msnger works thru PIN and the msgs shouldnt be counted as text msgs? I have another friend who is on Verizon and she is claiming if you are not BB Msnging from Verizon to Verizon they act as text msgs.
Maybe we need someone who has Verizon to chim in! Seems most of us in this thread have AT&T. Maybe I just need to call Verizon!

Thanks,
Mike

Are you 100% certain she is using the native BB Messenger and not the OZ Messenger which I think comes on Verizon phones?!?!? OZ uses text....

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:30 PM
Thanks all! Now I just need to get to the bottom why my g/f got hit with the extra charges!! I'm gonna ask her to send me a copy of her bill!! Really tho...I have not known this girl for very long but she has always been upfront and honest with me. I'll keep ya posted! :)

(Dawg...I'm not orig. from GA but have become a big UGA fan...Moreno is a blast to watch play)

Mike

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:32 PM
Are you 100% certain she is using the native BB Messenger and not the OZ Messenger which I think comes on Verizon phones?!?!? OZ uses text....

Hmm...good question! How can I tell or explain to her which is which??

Thanks,
Mike

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 12:32 PM
just have her sign up for online access to her bill and give you the UN and PW. that way you can check easily and dont have to worry about mail/fax.

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 12:32 PM
Hmm...good question! How can I tell or explain to her which is which??

Thanks,
Mike



OZ uses Instant Messaging, BBM uses your PIN number. Also, do you receive her messages via IM or BBM?

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:38 PM
OZ uses Instant Messaging, BBM uses your PIN number. Also, do you receive her messages via IM or BBM?

On my Curve...I go to the message blubble icon and under it it says "Blackberry Messenger." That is how I msg her and how I get messages from her. When a new msg comes in from her I get the smiley notification.

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 12:42 PM
then she is sending BB messages to you via PIN. not SMS/text

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:45 PM
then she is sending BB messages to you via PIN. not SMS/text

Ok. We are doing the long distance dating thing so I can't check her phone for another week to make sure she is really using BBM...but I believe you all.

Sometimes when I have a new BBM and I have not checked it yet and I'm in my email screen, the BBM shows up with the smiley in the email list. Does that make sense?

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 12:46 PM
yes, the message folder will show PIN/SMS/MMS/Email/BBM Conversations/Web Notifications. Its basically a catch all.

stangman39
02-06-2008, 12:54 PM
Her phone is linked to her parents family plan and her mom called this morning telling her the big jump in the bill due to her usage (extra $400!) and she said her mom called Verizon and they said it was due to text msgs and she said the only increased activity in messaging over the last month has been with me over the BBM. What I think it is is that she doesn't have unlimited data plan and went over her data allowance...but it still sure seems high to get charged an extra $400!!

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 12:57 PM
well its technically possible but VZW's data plan is "unlimited" (read 5gb). It has to be something else. at 10cents per message sent and 5cents received, it would be a minimum of 4000 sent to get an overage of $400.

Dawg
02-06-2008, 12:59 PM
Her phone is linked to her parents family plan and her mom called this morning telling her the big jump in the bill due to her usage (extra $400!) and she said her mom called Verizon and they said it was due to text msgs and she said the only increased activity in messaging over the last month has been with me over the BBM. What I think it is is that she doesn't have unlimited data plan and went over her data allowance...but it still sure seems high to get charged an extra $400!!

Yes if she only has the 10 mb data plan then that would certainly do it. I dont live to far from Roswell, Mike. We should grab a beer one night. We are still trying to organize a get together for all the local BBF members here in ATL some where. I need to revive that thread.

Thatzmister2u
02-06-2008, 01:45 PM
OZ uses Instant Messaging, BBM uses your PIN number. Also, do you receive her messages via IM or BBM?

I am almost certain that OZ is an "pseudo IM Client" that uses SMS to deliver IM like messages. There are members with unlimited text plans but without a data plan that use it to IM others.

But Sith, it does sound like something else is not right here. I guess we will see when he finally gets to the bottom of it!

E-

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 01:47 PM
oh i am very aware of how OZ works. It uses SMS to send IMs which sounds a bit backwards to me. but i was saying that if he received an IM then she wouldnt be using his PIN number

Thatzmister2u
02-06-2008, 01:50 PM
oh i am very aware of how OZ works. It uses SMS to send IMs which sounds a bit backwards to me. but i was saying that if he received an IM then she wouldnt be using his PIN number

Gotcha Sith! Point understood and agreed.

E-

stangman39
02-06-2008, 01:58 PM
She has confirmed she is pretty sure she has been using BBM b/c she clicked on the "bubble dialog" icon and then has the blue/yellow smiley faces. I really think it comes down to she doesn't have an unlimited data plan but I am waiting to find out for sure. Her phone is linked to her families plan and I'm sure they never saw a need for unlimited data. She should be able to upgrade to unlimited for another 10-20$/mo. She said we could just email for now while we get to the bottom of this but if it really comes down to it being her data plan emails are gonna run thru her data usage also!!

On another note..I see a lot of people wanting to setup and use other IM programs like Yahoo/Google etc. What is the advantage of this over using the BBM?

Thanks,
Mike

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 02:04 PM
that 10mb plan may not include unlimited email keep that in mind. i havent even seen an advertisement of VZWs 10mb plan in a long time and i have no idea if they changed it or not. You would be hard pressed to use 10mb of data with BBM in a given month. Was she doing any web browsing or emailing as well?

Thatzmister2u
02-06-2008, 02:06 PM
She has confirmed she is pretty sure she has been using BBM b/c she clicked on the "bubble dialog" icon and then has the blue/yellow smiley faces. I really think it comes down to she doesn't have an unlimited data plan but I am waiting to find out for sure. Her phone is linked to her families plan and I'm sure they never saw a need for unlimited data. She should be able to upgrade to unlimited for another 10-20$/mo. She said we could just email for now while we get to the bottom of this but if it really comes down to it being her data plan emails are gonna run thru her data usage also!!

On another note..I see a lot of people wanting to setup and use other IM programs like Yahoo/Google etc. What is the advantage of this over using the BBM?

Thanks,
Mike

So you can IM with the unfortunate people that don't have BB's! :) I would suggest JiveTalk if you are going to do it. It supports all of the IM's in one package and is very slick. It does cost but it's worth the price!

E-

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 02:07 PM
So you can IM with the unfortunate people that don't have BB's! :) I would suggest JiveTalk if you are going to do it. It supports all of the IM's in one package and is very slick. It does cost but it's worth the price!

E-

and it uses data not sms

Thatzmister2u
02-06-2008, 02:07 PM
(y) and it uses data not sms

stangman39
02-06-2008, 02:33 PM
that 10mb plan may not include unlimited email keep that in mind. i havent even seen an advertisement of VZWs 10mb plan in a long time and i have no idea if they changed it or not. You would be hard pressed to use 10mb of data with BBM in a given month. Was she doing any web browsing or emailing as well?

I spoke to a Verizon rep and they did confirm PIN msgs should be free if you have a data plan and don't go over your allotment.
She said 10mb plan is $29.99/mo and unlim is $44.99/mo.

Demon
02-06-2008, 02:36 PM
I spoke to a Verizon rep and they did confirm PIN msgs should be free if you have a data plan and don't go over your allotment.
She said 10mb plan is $29.99/mo and unlim is $44.99/mo.

The rep is correct about the PIN messages, but wrong on the data plan pricing.

stangman39
02-06-2008, 02:38 PM
From what I have read and heard from you all....am I correct in thinking that my g/f wouldn't have been able to use BBM at all IF she didn't have some type of data plan? So the chance that she doesn't have a data plan at all and that is how she racked up the $$ wouldn't make sense, right?

Demon
02-06-2008, 02:39 PM
From what I have read and heard from you all....am I correct in thinking that my g/f wouldn't have been able to use BBM at all IF she didn't have some type of data plan? So the chance that she doesn't have a data plan at all and that is how she racked up the $$ wouldn't make sense, right?

It is impossible to not have a data plan with Verizon. The system will not even activate the phone without it.

stangman39
02-06-2008, 02:41 PM
The rep is correct about the PIN messages, but wrong on the data plan pricing.

Wrong in the sense it is cheaper!!? I hope so b/c it seemed a bit high. I think I'm only paying $29 for ATnT unlimited data plan (before my corporate 19% discount! :) )

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 02:42 PM
Demon covered all of it. PIN messaging doesnt work without a data plan even *IF* you could activate the device without a BB plan (which you cannot on VZW, though you can on other carriers)

Demon
02-06-2008, 02:45 PM
Wrong in the sense it is cheaper!!? I hope so b/c it seemed a bit high. I think I'm only paying $29 for ATnT unlimited data plan (before my corporate 19% discount! :) )

Pricing for Verizon Blackberry data....
$24.99 - 10mb BES
$29.99 - Unlimited BIS
$44.99 - Unlimited BES
$64.99 - Unlimited Global BES

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 02:48 PM
Pricing for Verizon Blackberry data....
$24.99 - 10mb BES
$29.99 - Unlimited BIS
$44.99 - Unlimited BES
$64.99 - Unlimited Global BES

check your ATT discount, it applies to Voice only, not Data

stangman39
02-06-2008, 03:05 PM
Pricing for Verizon Blackberry data....
$24.99 - 10mb BES
$29.99 - Unlimited BIS
$44.99 - Unlimited BES
$64.99 - Unlimited Global BES

Sorry, what is the diff. b/t BIS and BES? Would any of them include PIN msgs in the data usage?

Sith_Apprentice
02-06-2008, 03:10 PM
BIS is the personal/small business solution, BES is corporate. check the blackberryfaq.com site for a comparison

JSanders
02-06-2008, 03:34 PM
Main Page - BlackBerryFAQ.com (http://blackberryfaq.com/index.php/Main_Page#Internet_and_Email_FAQ.27s_.28BIS.2FBES.29)

AZBORICUA
12-19-2008, 11:58 AM
check your ATT discount, it applies to Voice only, not Data

Just as fyi, My company's discount works on my data plan also.

tjchrisi
12-19-2008, 12:27 PM
bbm contact info says available but is really idle - 12-17-2008, 05:30 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is making me crazy. I have bbm contact that is showing active for status but to get a true status I have to either ping or write a message. i want to know if he is idle or busy before I send it. What am i doing wrong?

Tray

Demon
12-21-2008, 11:07 PM
Just as fyi, My company's discount works on my data plan also.

Some corporate profiles give a 20% data discount, but not all.