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View Full Version : Another Verizon GPS HACKING thread


kdrweez
05-27-2008, 10:58 PM
If there's interest...while some folks have been calling Verizon and getting denied (me being one), and others hope Verizon will change their minds...

Let's start a legitimate discussion on making our own workaround for the locked GPS feature. Maybe it's possible, maybe it isn't, who knows. Worth a shot to start discussing, IMO.

List things that you've tried, want to try, etc. Maybe it'll lead somewhere.



Today I tried loading Google Maps with my puck, switching the OS to "Device GPS" and going back to Google Maps. No deal :(

John Clark
05-27-2008, 11:04 PM
This has been discussed here ad infinitum. There are two ways to get GPS on a VZ BB.

1. Pay for VZNavigator.
2. Bluetooth Puck.

That's it. There is no hacking, no editing, no nothing that can be done to get it any other way.

kdrweez
05-27-2008, 11:17 PM
This has been discussed here ad infinitum. There are two ways to get GPS on a VZ BB.

1. Pay for VZNavigator.
2. Bluetooth Puck.

That's it. There is no hacking, no editing, no nothing that can be done to get it any other way.

Yes, but I'm sure you're familiar with the activation features XP had, and those were "undefeatable." Or the Verizon-blocked features of the WM phones. Or even the iPhone.

I'm not saying there is a way, and I know it has been discussed thoroughly. But I'd like to see if there are any other people legitimately interested in continuing to hunt for such a workaround. :)

John Clark
05-27-2008, 11:19 PM
It's a dead horse. This topic just gets folks all wound up.

JSanders
05-27-2008, 11:32 PM
If there's a way, then just do it. But it is really odd that so very many in this forum have tried and tried and keep coming up empty handed. Maybe your venture will be different.

As John said: Dead horse.

daphne
05-28-2008, 12:15 AM
Even if you could do it, you would likely void your warranty on the device and violate Verizon's TOS.

serrano_yejo
05-28-2008, 06:29 AM
As John said: Dead horse.

You may be a non-believer... but the prophecy says otherwise...:razz:

Dawg
05-28-2008, 06:51 AM
SMFH Here we go again. Its always the new folks that want to stir the pot.

Its not even just dead there are no bones left. So its just beating a dead carcass.

Pay to play or leave it alone. Only two ways to make it work.

ezrunner
05-28-2008, 06:54 AM
I use a map and compass!!!

NJBlackBerry
05-28-2008, 06:59 AM
Please note there is nothing official about this post.

An old one, yes, but not official.

So, how is all that BlackBerry hacking coming along. Haven't had a hack post in a while.

juwaack68
05-28-2008, 07:01 AM
I had a hacking cough this morning. Does that count?

ezrunner
05-28-2008, 07:02 AM
I had a hacking cough this morning. Does that count?


only if you were using you BB at the same time as the cough took place:razz:

customshopkv1
05-28-2008, 08:11 AM
Just a question:
I had a XV6800 for about 5 months before I got my Blackberry and was able to load a "cooked rom" off of xda developers web site that enabled GPS and EVDO Rev. A on the device without having to pay Verizon. Are the blackberry devices controlled differently? What is the difference?

Dawg
05-28-2008, 08:20 AM
yes there security is unmatched. You cannot crack the security of them thats why so many governments use them. and not the devices that can be cracked on a whim.

customshopkv1
05-28-2008, 08:27 AM
yes there security is unmatched. You cannot crack the security of them thats why so many governments use them. and not the devices that can be cracked on a whim.

Thanks for the info. Windows Security = Oxymoron

Blackberry Guru
05-28-2008, 08:47 AM
I can't believe I even opened this, I haven't learned my lesson by now!

Oh well........

JSanders
05-28-2008, 08:51 AM
I can't believe I even opened this, I haven't learned my lesson by now!

Oh well........


hahahaha. You never get something different by doing the same thing over again, eh?

jungleland
05-28-2008, 09:22 AM
Yes, but I'm sure you're familiar with the activation features XP had, and those were "undefeatable." Or the Verizon-blocked features of the WM phones. Or even the iPhone.

I'm not saying there is a way, and I know it has been discussed thoroughly. But I'd like to see if there are any other people legitimately interested in continuing to hunt for such a workaround. :)



Dude, it's not possible on our end. You would need to literally hack in to VZW's systems and activate on their end. And that's the ONLY way it can be done.

CO_BBTechie
05-28-2008, 10:03 AM
Oh and here I thought this was an actual "official" thread. Some words should just be disallowed in thread titles. Here's a sure fire way to hack VZW's restrictions... dump 'em.

Dawg
05-28-2008, 10:06 AM
Oh and here I thought this was an actual "official" thread. Some words should just be disallowed in thread titles. Here's a sure fire way to hack VZW's restrictions... dump 'em.

And here they come outta the wood works

FF2
05-28-2008, 11:39 AM
yes there security is unmatched. You cannot crack the security of them thats why so many governments use them. and not the devices that can be cracked on a whim.

Ah, that explains why India lost out on its bid to get inside info - the US Government counter-threatened RIM due to security issues with India spying on the US which is spying on India, etc, etc, and so forth.

I like these threads. They help introduce poor Verizon newbies or potential newbies to Verizon's policy to lock the gps. Many folks don't know that and do not know to even ask about it.

Verizon does not have big signs at their stores or on their web site saying:

"Nah, Nah, Nah, you cannot use the GPS without paying us another $10.00 per month, and even it you do, you still canNOT use a gps program of your choice unless you buy your own 3rd party gps puck"

So, these periodic rehashing of Verizon's policy is probably helpful even if the venting does not help the rest of us.

Dawg
05-28-2008, 11:43 AM
Ah, that explains why India lost out on its bid to get inside info - the US Government counter-threatened RIM due to security issues with India spying on the US which is spying on India, etc, etc, and so forth.

I like these threads. They help introduce poor Verizon newbies or potential newbies to Verizon's policy to lock the gps. Many folks don't know that and do not know to even ask about it.

Verizon does not have big signs at their stores or on their web site saying:

"Nah, Nah, Nah, you cannot use the GPS without paying us another $10.00 per month, and even it you do, you still canNOT use a gps program of your choice unless you buy your own 3rd party gps puck"

So, these periodic rehashing of Verizon's policy is probably helpful even if the venting does not help the rest of us.

if it was periodic that would be great but its more like daily. Its the consumers fault if they havent researched the product they are buying.

Ashg
05-28-2008, 11:59 AM
For all of Verizon's misgivings they still have one of the lowest churn rates in the industry and some of the highest adds per quarter. Sure, their Walled Garden approach is annoying as heck and they nickle and dime you to death, but for many of us their presence and service are the best in the area and far better than the competition.

The day you find the combination of phone and service that has 100% of what you want and absolutely nothing that you don't like will never come. My 8830 is a quality phone with many features that make me happy to use it, gimped GPS or not.

John Clark
05-28-2008, 12:02 PM
For all of Verizon's misgivings they still have one of the lowest churn rates in the industry and some of the highest adds per quarter. Sure, their Walled Garden approach is annoying as heck and they nickle and dime you to death, but for many of us their presence and service are the best in the area and far better than the competition.

The day you find the combination of phone and service that has 100% of what you want and absolutely nothing that you don't like will never come. My 8830 is a quality phone with many features that make me happy to use it, gimped GPS or not.


Well-said.

Dawg
05-28-2008, 12:37 PM
For all of Verizon's misgivings they still have one of the lowest churn rates in the industry and some of the highest adds per quarter. Sure, their Walled Garden approach is annoying as heck and they nickle and dime you to death, but for many of us their presence and service are the best in the area and far better than the competition.

The day you find the combination of phone and service that has 100% of what you want and absolutely nothing that you don't like will never come. My 8830 is a quality phone with many features that make me happy to use it, gimped GPS or not.

right on the money.(y)

joepelaez
05-28-2008, 12:57 PM
I am not sure who's "end" it is on, it seems it is on the device itself to me. I can open VZNav and open a follow-me-map, then switch applications to BB Maps or Google Maps, etc and those apps work with the internal GPS. That is why I think it is the device rather than VZW.

FF2
05-28-2008, 01:05 PM
I am not disputing the fact that Verizon may have great service/coverage. I've had them for about 10 years. But that does not mean I cannot occasionally criticize them.

And it may be well and good to suggest if folks did their research they'd know about the deficiencies but we have also read about folks asking at the shops and getting wrong answers. They ask if the 8830 has a gps and get a YES answer. How much digging is necessary after that "half truthful answer?" Why do folks have to suddenly discover that Verizon has a $30.00 BIS plan by accidently seeing a thread such as this even after asking for the cheapest plan at the stores.

Frankly, I'm still not clear from all of the various threads if you can activate Verizon's gps service and gain access to 3rd party applications. I've read peoples' thoughts on that but I've never seen any direct posting by Verizon saying if you pay $10 you still can only use Verizon's software. I'm pretty certain I know the answer but that's not the same as seeing it in writing, from verizon, clearly enunciated - and, we all know asking a customer rep at the official shop guarantees NOTHING.

FF2
05-28-2008, 01:07 PM
I am not sure who's "end" it is on, it seems it is on the device itself to me. I can open VZNav and open a follow-me-map, then switch applications to BB Maps or Google Maps, etc and those apps work with the internal GPS. That is why I think it is the device rather than VZW.

Okay, is this true? See my thread just above - I've seen various answers on whether or not 3rd party gps applications can be used if you pay for Verizon's service. I've seen most saying it is NOT possible. Now you say it is possible.

joepelaez
05-28-2008, 01:15 PM
It does work, but you simply can not just open the app, you also have to open the follow-me-map. Then switch to another app by pressing the "send" button, once in the call log go to options and select Switch Application. From here you can go to the home screen and select your application of choice.

Dawg
05-28-2008, 01:17 PM
Joe doe it say with in so many meters? If so its not gps but triangulation.

FF2 the truthful answer is yes it does have GPS. You just have to pay for it.

I went into a sprint shop with my brother on saturday, he asked the tech does my sprint 8130 have MMS the tech said yes. So my brother hands him the phone and says then send one. The tech worked his butt off trying to prove that it does have MMS. We already knew the answer to the question. SO I handed him my pearl and he was amazed at the differences.

You can not trust anyone in sales period. Especially retail sales. They want to make a sale and hope like hell they arent there when you come back.

FF2
05-28-2008, 02:06 PM
Joe doe it say with in so many meters? If so its not gps but triangulation.

FF2 the truthful answer is yes it does have GPS. You just have to pay for it.

I went into a sprint shop with my brother on saturday, he asked the tech does my sprint 8130 have MMS the tech said yes. So my brother hands him the phone and says then send one. The tech worked his butt off trying to prove that it does have MMS. We already knew the answer to the question. SO I handed him my pearl and he was amazed at the differences.

You can not trust anyone in sales period. Especially retail sales. They want to make a sale and hope like hell they arent there when you come back.

Well, that is why I do take some offense when someone throws out the line: "if the purchaser had done research......"

Hey, I got suckered in to the 8830 when Verizon was offering the discount, a renewal bonus AND A $100.00 REBATE. I had been two TWO separate shops and both said all THREE price reductions were effective. I purchased, submitted my rebate and WAS DENIED. I was pretty ticked. Now, I will first say that the shop manager made good with a $100.00 credit. But when I called the Verizon rebate - "cannot be combined with any other discount" I say the form was printed and I was assured..... "cannot be combined.

At the shop I got the same reply from 3 reps "cannot be combined, altho I don't know why the rebate form even printed since it should not...." Manager says same but starts looking at my account and says "well, for you....." and gives me the credit. It really should not take that much but they did make good.

But if you canNOT get answers at the official verizon shop, then.....

And that is probably why this and similar forums for all kinds of products are so "healthy" - venting is permitted within reason.

Dawg
05-28-2008, 02:33 PM
Well, that is why I do take some offense when someone throws out the line: "if the purchaser had done research......"

Hey, I got suckered in to the 8830 when Verizon was offering the discount, a renewal bonus AND A $100.00 REBATE. I had been two TWO separate shops and both said all THREE price reductions were effective. I purchased, submitted my rebate and WAS DENIED. I was pretty ticked. Now, I will first say that the shop manager made good with a $100.00 credit. But when I called the Verizon rebate - "cannot be combined with any other discount" I say the form was printed and I was assured..... "cannot be combined.

At the shop I got the same reply from 3 reps "cannot be combined, altho I don't know why the rebate form even printed since it should not...." Manager says same but starts looking at my account and says "well, for you....." and gives me the credit. It really should not take that much but they did make good.

But if you canNOT get answers at the official verizon shop, then.....

And that is probably why this and similar forums for all kinds of products are so "healthy" - venting is permitted within reason.

I understand and see your point. But its really easy to log on to the web and google verizon Blackberry's or what ever and see the many pages on what they do and do do. So its still the person buying the devices responsibility to know prior to going into the store so they don't get ripped off.

And Again Verizon isnt the only company out there doing questionable things (even though I dont see it as questionable). Hell look at rogers they hail from the land of BBS and they still dont offer a great Bb data plan.

kdrweez
05-28-2008, 05:59 PM
I have no progress personally - I am just starting a spot for people who'd like to discuss this matter further. You say it brings people out of the woodwork, so what's wrong with a little more activity? Not hurting anyone. :)

Dawg
05-28-2008, 06:14 PM
because its a dead subject and not worth the bandwidth it wastes everytime its brought up

BubbaRob
05-29-2008, 08:48 PM
Wasted bandwidth on a forum site???? Whats the point of a forum site if not to ask questions, post information and promote interest of a certian topic??? You can't be serious!!


Rob

John Clark
05-29-2008, 08:55 PM
Wirelessly posted (BB 11020)

*shakes head*

How long until yet anothe VZW thread is closed.

BubbaRob
05-29-2008, 09:06 PM
If the head shaking was in reference to my post..then I say Shake Away!!

If they close the thread its a shame.....defeats the whole purpose of a "forum" in my opinion. But we all know what opinions are often compared to...lol

John Clark
05-29-2008, 09:12 PM
The head shaking is in reference to the whole thread and "VZW GPS Hacking" topic in general.

http://www.blackberryforums.com/general-8800-series-discussion/132115-another-verizon-gps-hacking-thread.html#post946501

I almost closed it at post #2 but left it open as a courtesy to the OP.

Dawg
05-30-2008, 06:42 AM
If the head shaking was in reference to my post..then I say Shake Away!!

If they close the thread its a shame.....defeats the whole purpose of a "forum" in my opinion. But we all know what opinions are often compared to...lol

There is nothing else to be discussed if it can be said about this subject its been said on this forum in depth many times. So thats why its a waste of bandwidth.

penguin3107
05-30-2008, 07:23 AM
What I find incredibly ironic is that the very people who complain about these threads degenerating into a useless flame war are also the very people that cause it to happen in the first place.

Dawg
05-30-2008, 07:59 AM
you do your share of starting flame wars as well there mr Penguin. Those without sin shall cat the first stone I think is how the saying goes.

JSanders
05-30-2008, 08:56 AM
Papa Smurf says,

"Can't we all just get along?"

http://www.80stees.com/images/products/Smurfs_Poppa_Smuf-Statue.jpg

penguin3107
05-30-2008, 09:14 AM
you do your share of starting flame wars as well there mr Penguin. Those without sin shall cat the first stone I think is how the saying goes.

I do?

knipknup
05-30-2008, 09:58 AM
ib4tl!

glorman
05-30-2008, 10:45 AM
I don't post here much, but this needs to be said. If you don't want to talk about this issue, why don't you just stay out of the thread? Allow the people who are interested to talk about it. Do you go to movies you know you won't like and shout at the screen about how bad the movie is?

TBOLTRAM
05-30-2008, 11:04 AM
This issue is currently in the legal system as a class action lawsuit. That is where the right or wrong will be determined. End of comment.

Ashg
05-30-2008, 11:43 AM
This issue is currently in the legal system as a class action lawsuit. That is where the right or wrong will be determined. End of comment.

If this is in Class Action stage, things could become very interesting.

I remember researching and asking questions about the GPS capabilities while the phone was in late development. VZW reps at HoFo were grilled on GPS functionality. All pre-release signs posted to the GPS being open and unlocked. I'm sure the evidence will include the initial advertisements and spec sheets that did not include the obligatory legal disclaimer *requires VZNavigator service to function. I think I may still have a copy somewhere...

This should be game, set, and match, but either VZW will win or the customers will get a free keychain for their troubles while the lawyers rake in a massive amount of legal fees.

Like I said before, I'm happy with my phone and the gimped GPS really doesn't mess with me at all. I will be interested to see the outcome, though.

jsntrenkler
05-30-2008, 12:57 PM
I too am waiting for the outcome.

Dawg
05-30-2008, 03:25 PM
when was the class action laws suit filed for this tbol? Thats the first I had heard of that one. I knew about other lawsuits that VZW lost. I think VZW will over come the lawsuit its already been proven that the ads werent vzw but resellers.

JSanders
05-30-2008, 03:29 PM
There's another thread about the class action lawsuit here somewhere. I don't know if anything ever came of it, if it was denied as a class, or still in the court.

test54
05-30-2008, 03:31 PM
the actual complaint against VZW filed 11/30/07:

http://www.cyberlaw.pro/docs/verizonbbcomplaint.pdf

tougher case than the others against VZW though.

Dawg
05-30-2008, 03:56 PM
I looked it up and it appears its not been settled or heard. I read the complain test. I am all for class action law suits and the right to sue. But I think the system needs to change and if you file a suit and loose the case you should have to pay for the cost of court. Sorry for the rant just my .02

TBOLTRAM
05-30-2008, 03:59 PM
when was the class action laws suit filed for this tbol? Thats the first I had heard of that one. I knew about other lawsuits that VZW lost. I think VZW will over come the lawsuit its already been proven that the ads werent vzw but resellers.

The answer to your question was posted earlier. The last time I checked it was in the legal system. I suggest you read the entire document and review the attachment which shows an advertisement which might be the deciding factor. Another thing is that the document is "praying" that the court orders VZW to turn on the GPS as the first request and monetary damages as a second request.

While you and I may disagree about what should be the final outcome I do agree that having infinite threads is rather stupid since this is now a legal issue. I understand that there is another petition with the FCC or someone floating around that basically says that since the federal government has declared GPS to be a "free" signal the phone companies should not be able to turn off the receiver in the phones. Not sure what will become of this.

Final comment is that I am flying to the Czech Republic tomorrow and it sure would have been nice if the damn thing worked. I bought an international SIM card from VZW and had the international voice/data service turned on. Hell, I would pay for them to turn on the GPS. VZ Navigator does not work in Europe. VZW still advertises the 8830 as a World Phone and that the phone has GPS.

Enough for now. I am not looking to flame or get flamed.

JSanders
05-30-2008, 04:02 PM
Enough for now. I am not looking to flame or get flamed.

Well, have a good trip.

Ashg
05-30-2008, 04:06 PM
You see, I'm not so sure about it being resellers...

Had VZW initially said anything to the effect of "GPS requires activation or extra cost" instead of just saying "built-in GPS" in their own initial adverts then I could see how VZW has a leg up. They didn't, and now they should have to pay the piper.

JSanders
05-30-2008, 04:11 PM
And here we go again. The crazy cycle.

Ashg
05-30-2008, 04:34 PM
The crazy cycle.

Crazy because there's nothing anyone can do but talk about it, or crazy because people are going to forget their qualms and start going nuts at each other?

Given that this is the Intaweb I can see a dead horse sitting next to a Rube Goldberg machine. I guess I'll shut up now and wait for the legal system to decide things.

test54
05-30-2008, 04:35 PM
I looked it up and it appears its not been settled or heard. I read the complain test. I am all for class action law suits and the right to sue. But I think the system needs to change and if you file a suit and loose the case you should have to pay for the cost of court. Sorry for the rant just my .02

I agree, however the one exception should be class action suits. Sometimes the goliath just has the better team and i would hate to see all the little people have to pay. As for all other suits absolutely, their needs to be some penalty for all the frivolous suits.

Dawg
05-30-2008, 07:15 PM
The answer to your question was posted earlier. The last time I checked it was in the legal system. I suggest you read the entire document and review the attachment which shows an advertisement which might be the deciding factor. Another thing is that the document is "praying" that the court orders VZW to turn on the GPS as the first request and monetary damages as a second request.

While you and I may disagree about what should be the final outcome I do agree that having infinite threads is rather stupid since this is now a legal issue. I understand that there is another petition with the FCC or someone floating around that basically says that since the federal government has declared GPS to be a "free" signal the phone companies should not be able to turn off the receiver in the phones. Not sure what will become of this.

Final comment is that I am flying to the Czech Republic tomorrow and it sure would have been nice if the damn thing worked. I bought an international SIM card from VZW and had the international voice/data service turned on. Hell, I would pay for them to turn on the GPS. VZ Navigator does not work in Europe. VZW still advertises the 8830 as a World Phone and that the phone has GPS.

Enough for now. I am not looking to flame or get flamed.

I was asking a serious question Tbol, As I really didnt know about the suit. I really wasnt trying to flame at all. I am reading the suit now.

Sorry if my post came across as snippy as some call it. There really was nothing meant by it at all.

Dawg
05-30-2008, 07:18 PM
And here we go again. The crazy cycle.

Not from me I am going to leave it alone.(y)

TBOLTRAM
05-30-2008, 09:12 PM
I was asking a serious question Tbol, As I really didnt know about the suit. I really wasnt trying to flame at all. I am reading the suit now.

Sorry if my post came across as snippy as some call it. There really was nothing meant by it at all.

Peace brother. :smile:

Cap41
05-30-2008, 10:44 PM
Mobile GMaps - View maps from various sources on your mobile phone! (http://www.mgmaps.com/)

I got this working on my 8800 (Bell) BB...its kind of confusing but it works...you basically download the map to a microsd card...so the map is stored on your device....than the gps works fine.

kdrweez
06-01-2008, 10:23 PM
Mobile GMaps - View maps from various sources on your mobile phone! (http://www.mgmaps.com/)

I got this working on my 8800 (Bell) BB...its kind of confusing but it works...you basically download the map to a microsd card...so the map is stored on your device....than the gps works fine.

Doesn't Bell have the GPS unlocked normally?

In other news, I decided to join the bunches who have called Verizon to harass. I gave them a speech that (not to toot my own horn) impressed my law student friend in the car with with me. I touched on pretty much every point that people here have against VZW's GPS deal, as well as suggesting that I'd pay the $10/mo if they'd let me use any application (my opinion). They transferred me to some "higher" customer support department, then a complaint department. I left my mark, and they said they will file it. That probably means they will take a coffee break and go discuss gas prices in the next cubicle over, but still couldn't hurt. I'm also kinda planning on calling once every week or 2 to check the progress of my complaint. Takes 10 minutes of my free time :)

Andyn
06-01-2008, 10:33 PM
I just emailed my government rep.....She said she can add the GPS feature to my 8830 for $9.50.

John Clark
06-01-2008, 11:52 PM
That gives you Verizon Navigator GPS app. You still can't use it with other applications that support the built in GPS.

BigA
06-02-2008, 03:54 AM
IMO I don't care if Verizon locks or disables features on my BB as long as they discount the phone to reflect the disabled features. Why should I pay the same price as someone at Sprint, AT&T, ect. While their phones are FULLY FUNCTIONAL and my VZW 8830 or 8330 is gimped. Now I recently explained that to an 8yr old and he even under stands the difference. Unlike some people. Especially Verizon.

BigA
06-02-2008, 04:09 AM
Last thought. I really do feel for Verizon simply because I hope that with all complaints and VZW bashing out there that I hope it was profitable for Verizon to charge for this VZnavigator access. My gut feeling is that it was not profitable for VZW, every user I know of that has a Verizon 8830 has not purchased VZnavigator or has and has canceled the service.

Would it be of any interest to do a poll on who has the service or not. I would like to see some real world numbers. My bet is it's less than 1% of BB 8830 users on VZnavigator.

Dawg
06-02-2008, 08:24 AM
IMO I don't care if Verizon locks or disables features on my BB as long as they discount the phone to reflect the disabled features. Why should I pay the same price as someone at Sprint, AT&T, ect. While their phones are FULLY FUNCTIONAL and my VZW 8830 or 8330 is gimped. Now I recently explained that to an 8yr old and he even under stands the difference. Unlike some people. Especially Verizon.

Sprint cant do MMS so you cant use sprint as a fully capable device.

I know ten or so people who pay for the service and love it. I have paid for it and it worked great. You already got a break on the price when you didnt pay full retail.

hollywoodfrodo
06-02-2008, 09:04 PM
I was ticked about the whole GPS fiasco. And I did do research and had heard from several places that it was disabled by Verizon but also from others that it wasn't. Ultimately I had an online chat w/Verizon Sales rep who asked me where I had heard it was disabled and said that was misinformation. She then said that they didn't disable it and it could be used with any software including 3rd Party. Then she said "I just checked to make sure and yes, it can be used with any 3rd Party software even if you don't subscribe to VZ Navigator."

Obviously she had no idea what she was talking about, but I print-screened the entire conversation so I would have proof and amo to use in complaining. So far I've gotten nowhere with conversations to "executive" Customer Service reps, but if Verizon gets enough angry customers, they might consider a change.

I mean, they know they have us by the balls since they hands down have the best network at least in most places, so they may just figure that they can do what they want and we're not going to leave them. But that's a crappy way to do business. And if enough people make waves, you never know. Could be a Verizon GPS revolution!!!

I'm off to write a letter to the President, and the CEO, and the BBB, and the ......................................................................... ;-)

BigA
06-02-2008, 09:56 PM
Sprint cant do MMS so you cant use sprint as a fully capable device.


Give me a break. It's not like I can't simply plug in my bb to desktop manager and download them off the phone for FREE. I would gladly take crippled MMS over gimped GPS anytime.

Problem is I am locked to VZW for the moment, work phone. But it won't be long before our CFO gets sick and tired of $$VZW$$. Thats when I make a sales pitch for Sprint or AT&T. Quite honestly I think that VZW could miss our 6 grand a month with service with them for the last 5yrs.

Dawg
06-03-2008, 07:55 AM
What does downloading them to the computer have to do with MMS. At least stay on topic. I stated they cant do MMS. I am not going to get into the who GPS topic again its been discussed enough on this forum. So there is your Break.

10ACTony
06-03-2008, 09:52 AM
For all of Verizon's misgivings they still have one of the lowest churn rates in the industry and some of the highest adds per quarter. Sure, their Walled Garden approach is annoying as heck and they nickle and dime you to death, but for many of us their presence and service are the best in the area and far better than the competition.

The day you find the combination of phone and service that has 100% of what you want and absolutely nothing that you don't like will never come. My 8830 is a quality phone with many features that make me happy to use it, gimped GPS or not.

Man you got that right! I switch my wifes phone to the "More bars" (but lots less quality) for a very short time and came back to Good Ole VZW in less than 6 months. AFAIC VZW's the Best. I can use my 8830 in places where a friends More Bars BB can't.
8-)

BigA
06-04-2008, 07:42 PM
What does downloading them to the computer have to do with MMS. At least stay on topic. I stated they cant do MMS. I am not going to get into the who GPS topic again its been discussed enough on this forum. So there is your Break.
MMS implies you are trying to send images, audio and video. All of which you can download via Desktop manager.

If you need me to draw it out for you I can.

Dawg
06-04-2008, 07:48 PM
yes but you cant send and that is what the discussion is about, do I need to spell it out for you?

BigA
06-04-2008, 09:22 PM
yes but you cant send and that is what the discussion is about, do I need to spell it out for you?

No thanks I just did.

Another Verizon GPS HACKING thread

LOL!


Mods please lock this thread. We are going way off topic, and are starting to circle the wagons!

haephaestus
06-04-2008, 11:02 PM
Seems kind of drastic to base corporate buying decisions on whether your carrier gives you GPS or not, no? I would understand consumer-side needs for GPS but first and foremost would be whether you're paying for a reliable network. We considered switching off Verizon for reasons other than GPS but always went back because you can't control where employees who need to be reached decide to make their homes. That is, unless your business needs GPS to conduct its business. If that were the case, I could think of better handheld solutions for navigation than the Blackberry.

DallasFlier
06-05-2008, 01:31 AM
You see, I'm not so sure about it being resellers...

Had VZW initially said anything to the effect of "GPS requires activation or extra cost" instead of just saying "built-in GPS" in their own initial adverts then I could see how VZW has a leg up. They didn't, and now they should have to pay the piper.
Lets see, by that line of logic, that add you posted also says it works on GSM/GPRS networks, but doesn't say that to get THAT to work that you must activate a service plan at a cost. So should they have to "pay the piper" because they're not giving you free cell service too?

DallasFlier
06-05-2008, 01:34 AM
IMO I don't care if Verizon locks or disables features on my BB as long as they discount the phone to reflect the disabled features. Why should I pay the same price as someone at Sprint, AT&T, ect. While their phones are FULLY FUNCTIONAL and my VZW 8830 or 8330 is gimped. Now I recently explained that to an 8yr old and he even under stands the difference. Unlike some people. Especially Verizon.
Currently AT&T sells the Curve with a new contract for $49, and T-Mobile sells it with a new contract for $249. Which of those two prices do you think you shouldn't have to pay? ;-)

BFEINZIMER
06-05-2008, 01:58 AM
You see, I'm not so sure about it being resellers...

Had VZW initially said anything to the effect of "GPS requires activation or extra cost" instead of just saying "built-in GPS" in their own initial adverts then I could see how VZW has a leg up. They didn't, and now they should have to pay the piper.

Verizon should have never sent me that... ;)

My scan still floats around! :P

RoC1909
06-05-2008, 03:34 PM
It's a dead horse. This topic just gets folks all wound up.

My thoughts exactly. Here's a better idea for all those who think they have been "shafted":

Change providers.

Easy as pie!!

SpectreBlofeld
06-06-2008, 12:24 PM
Verizon should at least unlock the GPS for third-party applications IF you subscribe to VZ Navigator! I'd settle for that, at least, probably in part due to the fact that I do use the service and it works very well, so I'd probably subscribe to it anyway.

John Clark
06-06-2008, 12:34 PM
They say they do but it hasn't been the case.

Ashg
06-07-2008, 11:20 AM
My thoughts exactly. Here's a better idea for all those who think they have been "shafted":
Change providers.
Easy as pie!!

If only.

Some of us signed a new 2-year agreement after rolling two years of pocket change and eBaying personal items to afford the bloody thing. There's no money left to pay ETF plus another provider's startup costs, especially on a teacher's pittance.

Some of us do not have another provider in their area that provides comparable coverage or service.

Easy as pie, my arse. You may have well as said "Let them eat cake".

Dawg
06-07-2008, 11:31 AM
while I understand your frustrations with VZW did you research the device or did you impulse buy it?

On the second thing I come from a family of teachers atleast 10 in my family right now. They do it because they love it and not one of them ever complain about what they make. On that note if you dont like what the job pays theer are other ones out there. Some of us are out of work and would love to make what a teacher makes right now.

Ashg
06-07-2008, 11:52 AM
Good Lord, I can't believe I'm about to have to defend myself like this.

First off, teaching is not a job for me. It is a calling. I tried doing other things that paid more, but nothing fulfilled me. I work with the youth of this country because I have a sense that I am helping to improve the future lives of impoverished students and that I am obeying what God has called me to do. I never complained about what I make, I simply made a remark of how it compares to other jobs.

If someone is dedicated enough to roll two years' worth of pennies and eBay things they don't need anymore, don't you think they'd research what they're buying? I checked press releases. I checked insider forums. I checked product web sites. I called and asked, then asked when I got to the store to buy it. You bet your sweet arse I researched my purchase. I got burned and I've learned my lesson - never trust Verizon to sell you a slice of pie without charging for the plate and fork to eat it with. That will be in the back of my mind when I start researching my next phone purchase two months before release, just like I did this one.

JSanders
06-07-2008, 12:12 PM
Odd how just the mention of the word V*r*z*n brings out such emotional responses. No other carrier I know of gets this kind of response.

Why is that? Can that question be answered without anyone getting flamed or a member here banned?

Dawg
06-07-2008, 12:16 PM
I didn't mean to belittle you at all I really didn't. That was never my intention at all. I apologize if you took it that way.

Did you research it on any blackberry forums like this and many others? Its never been a secret that is all I am saying.

When I switched to Verizon two years ago I knew full well the disabled features. I compared the networks to every carrier out there. I went with them for coverage that is always my first choice. Will the device work when and where I need it to. Verizon has been toying with devices for ever.

For the record I never ask a sales person anything you have to realize that its a job for them not a career. I know there are people out there like EZ that do it and do it right but 90% of the people on all carriers are just there for a check and will tell you what ever it takes to sell you the device. They are no better than a used car salesman.


Odd how just the mention of the word V*r*z*n brings out such emotional responses. No other carrier I know of gets this kind of response.

Why is that? Can that question be answered without anyone getting flamed or a member here banned?

when you are on the best on the block you are the ones the other gangs always have it out for.

And this is the only forum I visit that VZW gets attacked on a daily basis. I visit 6 other phone forums daily and its only here that this this gets brought up several times a day

black betty
06-07-2008, 12:18 PM
Why would anyone consider paying for something that is free for everyone else. if only VZW customers stuck together and drafted some type of protest using the resources available here it might nudge someone over there. IMO your all getting the shaft here. CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW!!!!

Dawg
06-07-2008, 12:22 PM
Why would anyone consider paying for something that is free for everyone else. if only VZW customers stuck together and drafted some type of protest using the resources available here it might nudge someone over there. IMO your all getting the shaft here. CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW!!!!

I dont pay for it because I dont need it. So how am I getting shafted? I can hear you now and everywhere I go and thats whats important to me.

black betty
06-07-2008, 12:45 PM
lmao i knew i would get a response from you, your like the sloman shield for VZW. but if your not using it it does not affect you. however you are correct service is most important, and if not for the employee package i am on w tmo i would go to VZW and use my TomTom for gps.

JSanders
06-07-2008, 12:47 PM
But my question was, that it brings out emotion on both sides.

You could call AT&T the scum of the earth, TMo blood-sucking smackers and Sprint a bunch of panty waisted boogers, and no one would care.

Dawg
06-07-2008, 12:57 PM
But my question was, that it brings out emotion on both sides.

You could call AT&T the scum of the earth, TMo blood-sucking smackers and Sprint a bunch of panty waisted boogers, and no one would care.

Thats true I dont know why its like that JS. Now on some of the forums I visit Sprint and Nextel bring out this kind of action. Somepeople are die hard sprint fans and they will call you every name in the book if you dont agree with them.

I understand that VZW isnt the greatest thing since sliced bread, I know they have changed their devices so people are upset. Every carrier has its faults just ask some of the ones who have sold them all.

Demon
06-07-2008, 01:05 PM
Good Lord, I can't believe I'm about to have to defend myself like this.

First off, teaching is not a job for me. It is a calling. I tried doing other things that paid more, but nothing fulfilled me. I work with the youth of this country because I have a sense that I am helping to improve the future lives of impoverished students and that I am obeying what God has called me to do. I never complained about what I make, I simply made a remark of how it compares to other jobs.

If someone is dedicated enough to roll two years' worth of pennies and eBay things they don't need anymore, don't you think they'd research what they're buying? I checked press releases. I checked insider forums. I checked product web sites. I called and asked, then asked when I got to the store to buy it. You bet your sweet arse I researched my purchase. I got burned and I've learned my lesson - never trust Verizon to sell you a slice of pie without charging for the plate and fork to eat it with. That will be in the back of my mind when I start researching my next phone purchase two months before release, just like I did this one.

With Verizon every phone you purchase comes with a 30 return period. If you were this unhappy with the product and service I am confused as to why you would not have returned it.

Ashg
06-07-2008, 01:12 PM
With Verizon every phone you purchase comes with a 30 return period. If you were this unhappy with the product and service I am confused as to why you would not have returned it.

Because a sales rep told me that it would be enabled in a future update, that's why I kept it. I've learned my lesson, I've had my altruism beat out of me, and I'll be taking everything I see from Verizon with a grain of salt from here on out.

kdrweez
06-07-2008, 02:17 PM
while I understand your frustrations with VZW did you research the device or did you impulse buy it?

I got it under warranty to replace a WM phone. So I could either stick with the 4395873495873 flaws of a Windows phone, or get a Berry free. Either way I'm in contract. And either way, what's wrong with trying to improve what your money gets you?

How's that trial going? I read there was another hearing on Friday.

Dawg
06-07-2008, 07:42 PM
I got it under warranty to replace a WM phone. So I could either stick with the 4395873495873 flaws of a Windows phone, or get a Berry free. Either way I'm in contract. And either way, what's wrong with trying to improve what your money gets you?

How's that trial going? I read there was another hearing on Friday.

You may be in a contract but you can buy your way out and go where you feel like it. If you are that unhappy go where you will be happy. Just because you got it under warranty doesnt mean you cant take it back with in thirty days.

I dont need to improve on what I have. I have exactly what I paid for.

TBOLTRAM
06-08-2008, 09:36 PM
I read somewhere that on June 6 the parties in the class action were going to take a crack at a solution. I wonder if the information about June 6 was correct/bogus and if correct if anything was "resolved."

cenuticket
10-11-2008, 12:12 PM
i work for Verizon and there is absolutly nothing you can do to hack the GPS.

cenuticket
10-11-2008, 12:21 PM
Good Lord, I can't believe I'm about to have to defend myself like this.

First off, teaching is not a job for me. It is a calling. I tried doing other things that paid more, but nothing fulfilled me. I work with the youth of this country because I have a sense that I am helping to improve the future lives of impoverished students and that I am obeying what God has called me to do. I never complained about what I make, I simply made a remark of how it compares to other jobs.

If someone is dedicated enough to roll two years' worth of pennies and eBay things they don't need anymore, don't you think they'd research what they're buying? I checked press releases. I checked insider forums. I checked product web sites. I called and asked, then asked when I got to the store to buy it. You bet your sweet arse I researched my purchase. I got burned and I've learned my lesson - never trust Verizon to sell you a slice of pie without charging for the plate and fork to eat it with. That will be in the back of my mind when I start researching my next phone purchase two months before release, just like I did this one.
answer to your question why VZW disables the GPS system is simply is to keep the device and network secure. if we enable the 3rd party GPS...anyone can hack to your phone very easily and have acess to all your informations (they can even make calls/text from your phone) our GPS cost only $10 and we just launched the 4.1 with live Traffic which beats anything in the market

jsconyers
10-11-2008, 12:26 PM
answer to your question why VZW disables the GPS system is simply is to keep the device and network secure. if we enable the 3rd party GPS...anyone can hack to your phone very easily and have acess to all your informations (they can even make calls/text from your phone) our GPS cost only $10 and we just launched the 4.1 with live Traffic which beats anything in the market

This may be true with the RAZR and other phones. Not so much for BlackBerry devices. Other carriers such as AT&T, Sprint and Tmobile allow 3rd party GPS applications on their devices and I have never heard of anyone hacking into a blackberry through this.

Regardless of GPS or not, I have not heard of anyone hacking a berry.

John Clark
10-11-2008, 02:15 PM
i work for Verizon and there is absolutly nothing you can do to hack the GPS.

You are brave. Someone working for Verizon posting in a Verizon GPS thread?? Pure suicide.

There have never been any reports of hacking into the GPS from any of the other carrier's BB's (CDMA or GSM.) It's a good story but I don't buy that excuse. Why is it that once you subscribe to VZNav the GPS can be used by other apps? It just doesn't hold water.

JSanders
10-11-2008, 04:17 PM
answer to your question why VZW disables the GPS system is simply is to keep the device and network secure. if we enable the 3rd party GPS...anyone can hack to your phone very easily and have acess to all your informations

buahahahahah. NOPE! No one can hack it. You have bought in your corporate talking points. It can't be hacked and access "all your informations".

What is 3rd Party GPS? the 8830 GPS is built in to the device, not 3rd party.

our GPS cost only $10 and we just launched the 4.1 with live Traffic which beats anything in the market

Again, wrong. the AT&T Nav app (TeleNav) has live traffic. Check it out. Oh--you can't on Verizon if your's is locked, eh?

TroyDBrown
10-11-2008, 04:48 PM
I am from T-Mobile, hack our GPS I bet you can't!

BigA
10-13-2008, 12:42 AM
yes there security is unmatched. You cannot crack the security of them thats why so many governments use them. and not the devices that can be cracked on a whim.
Not only that.. If you did hack into it, then made it public, I would expect a visit from the NSA or FBI take your pick. Both would be interested in your hack. Since both departments use bb's for it's internal email and data solutions.

Good luck!! Say hi to buba at Gitmo for me..

Demon
10-13-2008, 08:15 AM
answer to your question why VZW disables the GPS system is simply is to keep the device and network secure. if we enable the 3rd party GPS...anyone can hack to your phone very easily and have acess to all your informations (they can even make calls/text from your phone) our GPS cost only $10 and we just launched the 4.1 with live Traffic which beats anything in the market

This is not possible. Period. Please don't give Verizon and yourself a bad name here by spouting this misinformation.