Trackball vs Wheel

[guinda35]

The only hesitation I have on the 8800 is its trackball substitute for the trackwheel that I've gotten used to over the years. I can see that the trackball will make it easier to use the berry with the left hand only -- difficult to do with the trackwheel. But what kind of experience have people had with the trackball, after being trained on the wheel? Do they miss the wheel?

[BlackBerryCoolSteve]

I had the same worries, really. I'm pretty attached to my 8700 and didn't want to make the move to the pearl-nav style. But after messing about with an 8100 for a bit, I'm pretty excited to be upgrading. Just think about typing with a QWERTY keyboard and not having to readjust your hands to navigate the trackwheel - the pearl's at thumb's reach waiting for you.

[juice901]

I bought the Pearl just for the hell of it because I saw it at a good price. I had no intention of keeping it long term...but after navigating with the trackball I loved it (except the suretype). I think the trackball is far easier to use than the wheel...in fact I can't stand the wheel now. I'm really looking forward to the QWERTY/trackball combo.

[No Longer Registered.]

I think it boils down to what you were used to. It is not an instant favorite of mine but I think I will get the hang of it and will like it. Though I didn't really play with my Pearl that long, enough to really say I prefer the trackball, it wasn't bad at all.

[blakeatl]

Pearl was my first blackberry ever, and I've had an 8700c now for about a month and the trackball is the winner hands down. It's soooo much easier to navigate with than the scroll wheel.

[greggebhardt]

I tried the Pearl for a few weeks and the trackball was not as bad as the SUreType keyboard.

What I do not like about the trackball was it did not have any tactile feedback. No clicking, you could feel to let you know that you have moved the cursor. You HAVE to look at the screen to seen what you are doing. I also would move the cursor when I was trying to click the trackball. If my thumb was dry it would turn the ball less, if damp, more.

I guess I will have to get used to it and I am sure I will. It is nice to be able to move both up and down plus left and right! Time will tell but I will adjust!

[tankee531]

I received mixed feedbacks on Pearl's trackball from my 7130/7100 users.

After using it for a day, most did not like the trackball and opted to stay with their current devices. Some chose to learn to get use to the trackball because they liked the size and the camera. Only 1 said he prefered the trackball over the wheel.

Personally, I prefer the wheel over the trackball.

[John Clark]

The trackball is WAY better than that trackwheel thingy! It's so much more comfortable, I can navigate much quicker. It's nice to be able to move the cursor any direction without having to use two hands. Overall I give the trackball a big (y)

[tHEmaCHInE]

Trackball all the way. Had a BB for a long time and would never go back.

[Lex Luthor]

I have been a long term BlackBerry user and to be honest I thought I would have missed the trackwheel but I don't. The trackball is so much better!! It's easier to navigate and I can use the device in my left hand now if I want also. I think anyone who uses a Pearl or the forthcoming 8800 will love the trackball.

[sixtyfoxtrot]

I prefer the wheel. Trackballs are for Centipede and Missle Command. If BB wants to stay with the trackball, at least make it bigger and a bit more rugged.

[sandman02002002]

what about using in dusty places? how would you clean it? the track ball is nice but comp mice get miss up and dirty all the time and are a pain to keep clean.

[archer6]

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8700/4.1.0 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

I received mixed feedbacks on Pearl's trackball from my 7130/7100 users.

After using it for a day, most did not like the trackball and opted to stay with their current devices. Some chose to learn to get use to the trackball because they liked the size and the camera. Only 1 said he prefered the trackball over the wheel.

Personally, I prefer the wheel over the trackball.

I see the keyboard as more of an issue than the trackball. The 7130c has a terrific keyboard, so much better than the 8700. After seeing the sculptured keys on the 8800 it too may be as cumbersome as the 8700 keyboard.

[backbeat]

What I do not like about the trackball was it did not have any tactile feedback. No clicking, you could feel to let you know that you have moved the cursor. You HAVE to look at the screen to seen what you are doing. I also would move the cursor when I was trying to click the trackball. If my thumb was dry it would turn the ball less, if damp, more.
I echo your concern about no tactile feedback. If unable to 'click' to select within a menu, it's less than perfect. May be able to adjust and accept it as it is since the trackwheel is certainly less than perfect also.

Since I use a trackball-based mouse at my main computer, (which I wouldn't trade for any other mouse), I can also appreciate the maintenence concern. Between skin oil accumulation, dust, etc which makes for a nasty combination, this is a spec/design issue that RIM should be able to address with a better material for the trackball itself. Many plastics can be brought to a high/semi-high polish, but be resistant to allowing fingerprints (oils). Let's hope this is within RIM's plans.

[greggebhardt]

I am sure that Trackball durability was a major concern to RIM and I, like you, hope they did their homework. They are sure going to have alot of them out there very soon. I do think that the trackball will cause problems for those who like to toss their device in their pocket.

I am looking forward to getting used to the trackball and I do understand how nice it will be to have 4 way navigaton but I sure got used to my trackwheel!

[blakeatl]

what about using in dusty places? how would you clean it? the track ball is nice but comp mice get miss up and dirty all the time and are a pain to keep clean.


Optical trackball for the dusty places!

[moosehead]

Good topic guinda35. Being a 8700c user that would be my biggest challenge in converting to a 8800. Then again when I first bought my 8700c I wondered how the heck I'm gonna get use to the trackwheel. Glad to see others who have used both post and provide opinion.

Thx

[bigjay8510]

Wirelessly posted (blackberry 8700c: BlackBerry8700/4.1.0 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

My gf has a pearl I really like the ball for example its easy to navigate emails, easier to just select things (rather then getting the menu). But with the 8700 I like the size and how it fits in my hand and how I can use the wheel.but I do not see a problem getting use to the ball. I figure it will be similiar to the first time I got my 8700 took me a week to get use to it.

[takeshi]

I'm a bit concerned about the lack of tactile feedback on the ball and how resistant it is to oil and dirt/dust. I solely use trackballs on my PC's but they're optical (Logitech Trackman)... I'm also hoping that RIM did their homework on this.

[jetspeedz]

im a long time bb user and not too long ago upgraded from the 7290 to the 8700 only b/c after playing around with the pearl for about 1 min i had enough and no way i was going to switch to a ball... plus i need a full qwerty pad vs the suretype... im hoping the 8800 keyboard will be better then the 8700 and will give the trackball another try

[archer6]

I am looking forward to getting used to the trackball and I do understand how nice it will be to have 4 way navigaton but I sure got used to my trackwheel!

Adjusting to the trackball is something I embrace. My one remaining concern is the keyshape & ease of use of the keyboard.

A good qwerty keyboard is the key to truly enjoying the device for one of it's signature features - email.

I for one will be relieved if RIM has placed a suitable priority on this & incorporated a high quality keyboard on this model.

[greggebhardt]

If the keyboard works as well as my 8700c I would be very happy. If it is better, I will be more happy. The shape of the keys on the 8800 is quite interesting. Looking forward to using the 8800 soon.

I am hoping the 8800 will fit into one of my RIM leather cases until they come out with the leather case for the 8800. The plastic clip holster it will come with is not for me.

[johnfromphilly]

If the keyboard works as well as my 8700c I would be very happy. If it is better, I will be more happy. The shape of the keys on the 8800 is quite interesting. Looking forward to using the 8800 soon.

I am hoping the 8800 will fit into one of my RIM leather cases until they come out with the leather case for the 8800. The plastic clip holster it will come with is not for me.


Greg, from what I have read here and elsewhere, there will be no holster included at all. I believe that was the case with the pearl also. I recently watched an unboxing of the 8800 and there was no holster.

[Amahk]

I am hoping the 8800 will fit into one of my RIM leather cases until they come out with the leather case for the 8800. The plastic clip holster it will come with is not for me.

Is it for sure coming out with the plastic clip holster in the box. I was kinda hoping they'd give the leather one. If not I'll just order one from the blackberry site today since they're all up on the site already and it'll be here in time for next wednesday. I'll email my Cingular store rep to clarify if it comes with the plasitic holster for sure also.

[archer6]

I am looking forward to getting used to the trackball and I do understand how nice it will be to have 4 way navigaton but I sure got used to my trackwheel!


Adjusting to the trackball is something I embrace. My one remaining concern is the keyshape & ease of use of the keyboard.

A good qwerty keyboard is the key to truly enjoying the device for one of it's signature features - email.

I for one will be relieved if RIM has placed a suitable priority on this & incorporated a high quality keyboard on this model.

It's a deal breaker (for me) if it is less than excellent. After all I know they are capable of it, as the keybaord on my 7130c is superb.

Cheers

[Amahk]

Greg, from what I have read here and elsewhere, there will be no holster included at all. I believe that was the case with the pearl also. I recently watched an unboxing of the 8800 and there was no holster.

Hmmm their website comparison says differently
businessdotcingular.com/businesscenter/popup/blackberry-comparison-popup.jsp
What kind of holster did the 7130c come with?

Replace the 1st doth with a . hehe

[backbeat]

If the keyboard works as well as my 8700c I would be very happy. If it is better, I will be more happy. The shape of the keys on the 8800 is quite interesting. Looking forward to using the 8800 soon.

Because the device is a bit narrower than the 8700, the keys still have to accommodate the real estate allowed. Let's all hope both the key design and the key spacing provide a better than Treo experience. It would be nice if full email users, versus texters, find appeal in this new kid on the block.

[nike30]

The 8800 will come with a holster according to Cingular inner-company press release from 2/12/07.

http://www.blackberryforums.com/general-8800-series-discussion/65073-cingular-inner-office-memo-dispersed-2-12-a.html

[johnfromphilly]

I watched this video and was following this thread, sorry if I provided misinformation:

http://www.blackberryforums.com/general-8800-series-discussion/64764-8800-unboxing-video.html

Plastic holster is an accident waiting to happen anyway. ( Let my rationalization begin...) :)

[johnfromphilly]

Here is the link to RIM's spec sheet, it mentions accessories included and does not mention holster:

BlackBerry - BlackBerry 8800 (http://na.blackberry.com/eng/devices/device-detail.jsp;jsessionid=DB0F750DC07220C364EAF25232C2196D?navId=H0,C201,P403#tab_tab_specifications)

Accessories Included
USB cable
Wall Charger

[nike30]

Being that RIM's doesn't - yet Cingular's release does - maybe Cingular is adding the holster on their end.

We obviously have two conflicting reports - in 7 days we'll know the truth.

[johnfromphilly]

in 7 days we'll know the truth.


Smartest thing either of us has said.(y) :smile:

[guinda35]

I started focusing on my use of the trackwheel on my 8700c after starting this thread. I noticed there's a dull pain on the inside of my right-hand thumb, and that a callous is forming there. Everytime I click the trackwheel I get a slight burning sensation. Reminds me of grammar school after I learned to use a pencil.

My thumb is ready for a change.

[nsimpson]

I echo your concern about no tactile feedback. If unable to 'click' to select within a menu, it's less than perfect. May be able to adjust and accept it as it is since the trackwheel is certainly less than perfect also.

Since I use a trackball-based mouse at my main computer, (which I wouldn't trade for any other mouse), I can also appreciate the maintenence concern. Between skin oil accumulation, dust, etc which makes for a nasty combination, this is a spec/design issue that RIM should be able to address with a better material for the trackball itself. Many plastics can be brought to a high/semi-high polish, but be resistant to allowing fingerprints (oils). Let's hope this is within RIM's plans.


Blackberries are used by the deaf and not the blind. You should be looking at the screen when you use it. With the trackwheel you still have to look at the screen to navigate through the menues. The 8100 and 8800 have a setting so you can make a clicking sound when scrolling though so if you want to be a hotshot without looking down you can.

It bugged me for 1 day then i realized that it was a really smart system and very useful. Im completely pro trackball

[archer6]

Just read one of the advantages of the 8800 trackball, it's removable.

Then one can use it to play miniature bowling......8-)

[backbeat]

Blackberries are used by the deaf and not the blind. You should be looking at the screen when you use it. With the trackwheel you still have to look at the screen to navigate through the menues. The 8100 and 8800 have a setting so you can make a clicking sound when scrolling though so if you want to be a hotshot without looking down you can.
Since you're quoting me, I'm looking for the relationship between our 2 posts and I don't see it. :???:

My point wasn't about using the device without looking at it. My point was about having feedback from the trackball [as in scrolling, then depressing it, then the subsequent rebound] when selecting a menu item which wouldn't exactly be much of an engineering challenge.

[nsimpson]

Since you're quoting me, I'm looking for the relationship between our 2 posts and I don't see it. :???:

My point wasn't about using the device without looking at it. My point was about having feedback from the trackball [as in scrolling, then depressing it, then the subsequent rebound] when selecting a menu item which wouldn't exactly be much of an engineering challenge.

You were agreeing with this:


What I do not like about the trackball was it did not have any tactile feedback. No clicking, you could feel to let you know that you have moved the cursor. You HAVE to look at the screen to seen what you are doing.

As I stated its just something one has to try for a bit to get used to it. They have added aids like "clicking" sounds to make it more of an experiance.

Just use it, you will begin to love it. People dont like change but the truth is that this change is for the better.

[greggebhardt]

Greg, from what I have read here and elsewhere, there will be no holster included at all. I believe that was the case with the pearl also. I recently watched an unboxing of the 8800 and there was no holster.

sorry but I have heard different from several people who are pretty high up in Cingular. The Pearl, being a consumer model, did not have any type of holster but the 8800 is a business model is does have the plastic thing.

It does not matter to me as I have ordered two of the OEM leather holsters from RIM which will be here on Monday. The 2gb miniSD is waiting now.

[greggebhardt]

You were agreeing with this:



As I stated its just something one has to try for a bit to get used to it. They have added aids like "clicking" sounds to make it more of an experiance.

I used the ball when I had the Pearl. It was growing on me but the SureType keyboard drove me nuts. I have no time for a learning curve as 50-60 emails a day in the field was just too much to muddle thru with SureType. I went back to my 8700 quickly.

I am sure me and the ball will get along fine in a few days, just let me have my QWERTY!

[backbeat]

As I stated its just something one has to try for a bit to get used to it. They have added aids like "clicking" sounds to make it more of an experiance.

We shall see, but now I'm starting to get an engineering-itch. May just have to get one just to make some improvements to in my spare time (and just in time for the production of the 9xxx). ;-)

[nsimpson]

I used the ball when I had the Pearl. It was growing on me but the SureType keyboard drove me nuts. I have no time for a learning curve as 50-60 emails a day in the field was just too much to muddle thru with SureType. I went back to my 8700 quickly.

I am sure me and the ball will get along fine in a few days, just let me have my QWERTY!

Yeah you will love it, Im kinda scared to go back to full qwerty cuz then i cant blame my poor spelling on the device. (it also fixes some of my mistakes as well)

[johnfromphilly]

sorry but I have heard different from several people who are pretty high up in Cingular. The Pearl, being a consumer model, did not have any type of holster but the 8800 is a business model is does have the plastic thing.

It does not matter to me as I have ordered two of the OEM leather holsters from RIM which will be here on Monday. The 2gb miniSD is waiting now.

Greg, I aggree that it will most likely have one, I have since even seen pictures of it. I am confused though by the conflicting info like this part of the RIM site I mentioned above:
BlackBerry - BlackBerry 8800 (http://na.blackberry.com/eng/devices/device-detail.jsp;jsessionid=DB0F750DC07220C364EAF25232C2196D?navId=H0,C201,P403#tab_tab_specifications)
It clearly says:
Accessories Included
USB cable
Wall Charger

But like we mentioned earlier- we will all know for sure when the 8800 comes out. (y)

[guinda35]

Just read one of the advantages of the 8800 trackball, it's removable.

Then one can use it to play miniature bowling......8-)
Shoot, my old 7200 was so rugged it could be used as a hockey puck. The 8xxx series look and feel like Chinese toys compared to the industrial strength of the old Berries.

BTW, I'm not looking to sell my 8700 after I get my 8800. It'll go in a display case next to my 7200. Someday...

[htmanning]

I too miss the clickwheel but I think in the long term, the trackball is better for your hand. I suspect that's the real reason they scrapped it. I also find the trackball easier to adapt to when I switch from my Treo to my BB and vice versa.

I'd frankly like to see RIM implement an optional stylus like my Windows Mobile Treo. It comes in handy on occassion.

Tom

[backbeat]

I'd frankly like to see RIM implement an optional stylus like my Windows Mobile Treo. It comes in handy on occassion.

That would require that RIM incorporate a touchscreen first, of course.

[guinda35]

I'd frankly like to see RIM implement an optional stylus like my Windows Mobile Treo. It comes in handy on occassion.

Tom
When would a stylus come in handy? Just curious.

[Stinsonddog]

The battery life of my trackball sucks :-o

[Ophidian]

I started focusing on my use of the trackwheel on my 8700c after starting this thread. I noticed there's a dull pain on the inside of my right-hand thumb, and that a callous is forming there. Everytime I click the trackwheel I get a slight burning sensation. Reminds me of grammar school after I learned to use a pencil.

My thumb is ready for a change.

I hate to admit, but I am having the exact same problem... except ironically with the Pearl. I have a Pearl callous on the inside of my right thumb, and it feels like pins and needles when I click it. I started using to use my left thumb to spread the love, and it's reacting the same way.

I hope that with the additional real estate of the 8800, they'll be able to use a larger diameter trackball.

[backbeat]

I hope that with the additional real estate of the 8800, they'll be able to use a larger diameter trackball.

I'm hoping for the same. I'd have no interest in always having to thumb around a trackball the size of a pea. A diameter that small is bound to apply pressure more narrowly than should be necessary.

[greggebhardt]

Greg, I aggree that it will most likely have one, I have since even seen pictures of it. I am confused though by the conflicting info like this part of the RIM site I mentioned above:
BlackBerry - BlackBerry 8800 (http://na.blackberry.com/eng/devices/device-detail.jsp;jsessionid=DB0F750DC07220C364EAF25232C2196D?navId=H0,C201,P403#tab_tab_specifications)
It clearly says:
Accessories Included
USB cable
Wall Charger

But like we mentioned earlier- we will all know for sure when the 8800 comes out. (y)

If it does or does not makes no difference to me as I would never use the plastic POS. My OEM RIM Leather holster with swivel clip will arrive on Monday.

[guinda35]

If it does or does not makes no difference to me as I would never use the plastic POS. My OEM RIM Leather holster with swivel clip will arrive on Monday.
I think the 8800 comes with a leather holster with swivel clip. This would be a first for me. Anyone know of an alluminum case for the 8800 out yet? It was the best case I've ever used, when I had a 7290.

[greggebhardt]

I think the 8800 comes with a leather holster with swivel clip. This would be a first for me. Anyone know of an alluminum case for the 8800 out yet? It was the best case I've ever used, when I had a 7290.

If you look in the other thread in this section it shows a member of this section with a Cingular 8800 he just picked up. It DOES inlcude the leather holster so XCingular is giving us the good holster.

I do not like cases that stay on the phone while using it. The leather OEM case with the swivel belt clip will work perfectly for me!

[greggebhardt]

When would a stylus come in handy? Just curious.


After meals for my teeth. <VBG>
No stylus required is a Blackberry plus for me!

[guinda35]

After meals for my teeth. <VBG>
No stylus required is a Blackberry plus for me!
I guess htmanning is still thinking about my question. I can't for the life of me think of why anyone would want to %&*@<hidden> with a stylus. But you're right, picking your teeth would be one way to use it...or cleaning your ears.

[happiicamper]

trackball for me... move in any direction... the new pouch for the 8800 is great... has the nice blackberry clip!!!