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Old 11-09-2005, 01:33 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default [2005-11-09] U.S. judge says RIM patent case stay unlikely

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RICHMOND, Va., Nov 9 (Reuters) - Research in Motion Ltd. (RIM.TO: Quote, Profile, Research) (RIMM.O: Quote, Profile, Research), maker of the BlackBerry e-mail device, suffered a setback in a potentially damaging patent infringement suit when a judge said on Wednesday he was unlikely to await a U.S. patent office review.

U.S. District Judge James Spencer told a hearing he would consider whether a disputed $450 settlement with patent holding company NTP Inc. was enforceable before deciding whether to go forward with an injunction that could halt BlackBerry sales.

The U.S. Patent and Trademark Office earlier this year completed a re-examination of eight NTP patents and issued initial rulings rejecting all of the claims -- but it could take years for a final conclusion.

"Frankly it's highly unlikely that I'm going to stay these proceedings ... I don't run (patent office) business and they don't run mine," Spencer said.

There had been speculation the case could be suspended pending a full review by the patent office.

Shares of Waterloo, Ontario-based RIM fell $1.87 to $61.99 on the Nasdaq market. In Toronto, the stock fell C$1.90 to C$73.69. The company had no immediate comment on the court hearing.

NTP filed its suit against RIM in 2001 in U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Virginia. A jury found in favor of NTP in 2002.

In 2003, Spencer granted an injunction that would have halted U.S. sales of the BlackBerry and shut down its service, but stayed the injunction pending appeal.

An appeals court later scaled back the infringement ruling against RIM, but upheld some patent infringement claims.

Efforts by RIM to get the courts to stay case, including a request to U.S. Chief Justice John Roberts, have failed.

RIM and NTP reached a settlement in March, but the deal fell apart in June in a dispute over how to interpret its terms. RIM wants the settlement enforced.

Spencer called on Wednesday for briefs from both sides on the settlement issue.

"I intend to move swiftly," Spencer said. "I've spent enough of my life and time on NTP and RIM."
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Old 11-09-2005, 02:37 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Uh Oh RIMM! Time to shut down
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Old 11-09-2005, 02:39 PM   #3 (permalink)
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wow and i was just saying to myself were is ace with his anti rimm comments...lmao thanks ace right on time....
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Old 11-09-2005, 02:45 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I am wondering what is it going to take for the moderators ban our friend ace_2005. I see 52 posts to his credit, and I would be willing to bet that none of then have been productive or of any use to anyone here. I come here to learn and gather information that will be useful to me in my use of the BB. I choose to have a BB, If you do not like BBs or if you do not think they are worth your time, or money, that is fine. You have a right to do so and feel that way. Just do the rest of us a favor and stay out of here, do not come to irritate us. If you work for the competitiors and you must let us know that there is an alternative that is fine but do it constructively. One must lead such a hard and borring life when one can only resort to your tactics to make life enjoyable. Grow up man.
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Old 11-09-2005, 05:35 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Question: If they order Blackberrys shut down in the US, would visitors from other countries still have service via roaming, or will they just have phone service when they're in the US? Because if it is the latter, then there are ways for people in the US to keep their service.....get it from Canada!
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Old 11-09-2005, 06:57 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Great idea Writergal. I think this is only for those who have service in the US. It will be alot of roaming charges but a good workaround idea.
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Old 11-09-2005, 07:04 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Well it gives him something do while he finds reason to justify Good? Not like folks are jumping to purchase Good, besides it been a few mo's are they not due for another round of layoffs and restructure?
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wow and i was just saying to myself were is ace with his anti rimm comments...lmao thanks ace right on time....
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Old 11-09-2005, 09:59 PM   #8 (permalink)
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OK...I had a long day....I meant the former....meaning that if people in the US can't get service locally, but people from other countries can do so from their home service while in the US, they can get something from Canada....I guess most people get my drift anyway...
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Old 11-10-2005, 12:56 AM   #9 (permalink)
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writergal, you have to forgive ace_2005. he's an employee for RIM's competition, Good Technology (developers of GoodLink). he rarely, if ever, has anything constructive to say. i've given him a permanent break from being a part of these forums.

as for service in the United States being disabled, there's a few things to keep in mind (atleast these are my understandings). 1) the United States government will not be affected by the court ruling, should it be ruled against RIM; 2) the United States government access the RIM network for email using the same method that normal users, business and consumer; 3) since there is no differentiation between government and non-government accounts, in terms of network access, there's no real way of RIM shutting down services for non-government accounts without affecting the government accounts; 4) a reasonable amount of time would have to be given to place any sort of mechanism or technology in order to provide a non-interruption of service to said non-affected government accounts.

hope that makes sense. i doubt very seriously that we'll be seeing such an injunction on service (perhaps sales, though) any time in the near-term future. i doubt some of our government counterparts would care to see that either. and let's not mention that United States carriers (T-Mobile, Cingular, Sprint/Nextel, Verizon) are pushing these devices heavily. T-Mobile now has almost 700,000 BlackBerry users, including almost 10% (almost 70,000) in the last quarter alone! Cingular (8700c) and Sprint/Nextel (7100i) have new devices debuting in November (either currently out or due out in just over a week) with Verizon (7130e) having their new devices released in December; and T-Mobile (8700t) following within the first 3 months of 2006. i doubt the leaders of a multi-billion dollar industry would put this much effort into a product and service that would soon be spinning in the toilet. i put a lot more merit into those companies' understanding of the situation rather than that of market and news analysts, or even that of competitors who post on BlackBerry-centric forums for no good reason (no pun intended).
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Old 11-10-2005, 01:25 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I work for a very large company where all the managers, the ITdepartment and employees who travel more than 50% of the time have bb's. To say they would be PO'd if they lost blackberry service would be an understatement.

I recently purchased my own 7105t with unlimited BIS service from T-mobile and I love it! I travel a lot too and I find the bb indispensible (especially while waiting at the airport). It sure beats having to look for a hot spot and booting up the laptop just to check email and the local weather/attractions.
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Old 11-10-2005, 01:42 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finch
Well it gives him something do while he finds reason to justify Good? Not like folks are jumping to purchase Good, besides it been a few mo's are they not due for another round of layoffs and restructure?
Not to start any flames here (though I am getting my asbestos suit on):

"11/10/2005 8:05:34 AM Bear Stearns comments on Good Technology 61.22

Good Technology indicated to Bear Stearns that it is seeing uptick in demand due to RIMM/NTP litigation issues. Good indicated increase in demand as a backup to RIMM, notably from financial services firms. RIMM remains rated underweight. "
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Old 11-10-2005, 01:45 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jibi
writergal, you have to forgive ace_2005. he's an employee for RIM's competition, Good Technology (developers of GoodLink). he rarely, if ever, has anything constructive to say. i've given him a permanent break from being a part of these forums.

as for service in the United States being disabled, there's a few things to keep in mind (atleast these are my understandings). 1) the United States government will not be affected by the court ruling, should it be ruled against RIM; 2) the United States government access the RIM network for email using the same method that normal users, business and consumer; 3) since there is no differentiation between government and non-government accounts, in terms of network access, there's no real way of RIM shutting down services for non-government accounts without affecting the government accounts; 4) a reasonable amount of time would have to be given to place any sort of mechanism or technology in order to provide a non-interruption of service to said non-affected government accounts.
I had the same thoughts. You BES Admin types would probably know this better than I, but I would think that within the RIMM NOC, they can see the device information, including the send from address. While it may take a while, couldn't they, technically, white-list certain addresses or domains, ie .gov?
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:10 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jibi
writergal, you have to forgive ace_2005. he's an employee for RIM's competition, Good Technology (developers of GoodLink).
Just an important clarification:

He said "consultant", as I remember. There's a distinction between consultant and employee. Either way, we did not ban him because of that (Good_Guy is far more useful, BTW) but because of his posting history -- including previous registrations.
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:28 PM   #14 (permalink)
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In any event I for one applaud the action jibi and Mark are referring to, I was sick and tired already, I trust that when and if he is allowed back he will play by the rules. This is a medium for sharing information and trying to learn and teach others not a soapbox from which to preach personal agendas. Thank you moderators for keeping our best interest at heart.
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:31 PM   #15 (permalink)
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besides this forum i have never heard of goodlink if that means anything
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:34 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamcrn
besides this forum i have never heard of goodlink if that means anything
Not a problem and, unfortunately (to me, anyway ), not that uncommon. Our brand recognition has picked up dramatically over the last year, but if you are not (and not saying you are or you aren't) in the IT world, the chances of you hearing of us are pretty slim.
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:57 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Goodlink would be more appealing it it worked on current Blackberry devices---not just the old C++ ones. Since the Blackberry Connect deals certainly aren't moving very fast, something that went the other route (already worked on most everything else--and just added Blackberry device support) would be somewhat appealing. Wonder if Goodlink can do remote device (or at least mail/calendar/contact) wipes, password policies & lockouts, etc? Seems like with Palm/PocketPC devices, there is a lot of things that would be outside the Goodlink control and make security folks uneasy.
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Old 11-10-2005, 03:14 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good_Guy
Not a problem and, unfortunately (to me, anyway ), not that uncommon. Our brand recognition has picked up dramatically over the last year, but if you are not (and not saying you are or you aren't) in the IT world, the chances of you hearing of us are pretty slim.
I had not heard of GoodGuys either till i came here. and my feelings expressed above do not reflect on either you or your company. I like to learn and I am glad to read to your posts, as well as learn from them too, as I said that is what the forum is for.
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Old 11-10-2005, 03:22 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarvinK
Goodlink would be more appealing it it worked on current Blackberry devices---not just the old C++ ones. Since the Blackberry Connect deals certainly aren't moving very fast, something that went the other route (already worked on most everything else--and just added Blackberry device support) would be somewhat appealing. Wonder if Goodlink can do remote device (or at least mail/calendar/contact) wipes, password policies & lockouts, etc? Seems like with Palm/PocketPC devices, there is a lot of things that would be outside the Goodlink control and make security folks uneasy.
Looks like they have at least some of those features:
http://www.good.com/index.php/produc...ess_email.html

Don't know how far-reaching or compatible they are with all the various platforms it runs on, but looks pretty promising. I think GoodLink software is most popular in Legal channels.
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Old 11-10-2005, 03:26 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I've been to Good Technologies campus several times and am fairly familiar with their product. I'd have to say if our company was just now venturing into rolling out wireless email, we may very well have gone with Good. As it is we now have 7 BES w/3000 users and there is no way it makes sense to convert at this point.
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