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-   -   APPALLING customer service from RIM on bluetooth (http://www.blackberryforums.com/bluetooth-connection/163305-appalling-customer-service-rim-bluetooth.html)

carefactornil 12-04-2008 12:43 PM

APPALLING customer service from RIM on bluetooth
 
Like so many other people, I've not been able to get my bluetooth to synch because I'm using Widcomm/Broadcom drivers rather than the Windows ones.

I've tried numerous times to edit the .inf file and add my device but I've not got it to work and quite frankly I don't believe there should be this much pain on this. I'm in IT and if I can't get it to work then god knows what chance some other people have.

So I contacted RIM customer service (help@blackberry.net) to see what they had to say, and WHY they are happy for so many customers to go through this pain.

The replies I had staggered me, so I'll post them verbatim here below. I can't believe that if you're going to bother replying then you would just cut & paste the previous response when that's so clearly inappropriate.

I think I've basically given up with bluetooth connectivity but I thought I'd at least post this here as a warning to others about the level of customer service you can expect from RIM.

:x:x:x:x

----------
Thank you for contacting BlackBerry Customer Support regarding your current technical issue.
As we indicated previously, your service provider is your first point of contact for support.
BlackBerry Technical Support is available 24/7 if your provider needs to escalate the issue.
If you would prefer fee-based support from Research In Motion, please dial the appropriate telephone number below and enter option 3 in the phone menu.
As previously mentioned, all BlackBerry smartphone users have free access to the BlackBerry Technical Solution Center. The BlackBerry Technical Solution Center provides a repository of support information, documentation and frequently asked questions, with enhanced search capabilities so you can easily search for and find the BlackBerry support information you need. Please visit....(link removed)
Thank you again for contacting us Simon and enjoy the rest of your day.
Warmest Regards,
Julia
BlackBerry Customer Support
------Original Message------
From:
Received: Friday, November 28, 2008 3:14:16 PM (EST)
To: [email address]ubject:
Re: Bluetooth ; RQST00005898259
Patricia,
Thanks for your reply but I think you've missed my point.
Firstly I'm not an "organization", I'm just someone who bought a BlackBerry as a way to communicate more effectively. All I have difficulty with is connecting by Bluetooth. So PAYING RIM for support (individual or annual) on this doesn't really appeal - I think if you offer Bluetooth connectivity, it should be a little more open for your users, rather than limiting it to those with Windows-only BT. If I thought that RIM could actually help me resolve the problem I MIGHT consider doing this but every indication is that "you'll have to resolve your BT drivers on your own". Perhaps if there was any form of guarantee you can sort this problem out I'd consider it. I'm aware I have a carrier partner - the first thing I did was call them (Orange in the UK). Their response was "that's an issue with RIM and their software - you have to contact them". I agree with their assessment. After that I searched your support forums (....link removed)
The only vaguely helpful link is ....(link removed)] which basically says "we're well aware of this problem, but if you don't have Windows BT then YOU have to sort that problem out". What really annoys me is that I have Windows XP and therefore the Bluetooth drivers that RIM require, there's just no easy way to uninstall my Widcomm drivers and use the ones RIM insist on.
I've searched a lot of other forums and I can see people have done this, it just doesn't work for me. And I don't think I should HAVE to hack around low-level Windows configuration files to resolve this, and I work in IT.
To stress again, my point is that:
A) RIM should provide more support of Bluetooth drivers, especially something so widely used as the Widcomm/Broadcom ones that come pre-installed on Dell machines. Take a look out on the internet and see how many people have been asking this for well over a year and it's such a reasonable and common expectation not to have to use a USB cable to synchronise.
B) If you're not going to do this, then at least provide a simple guide on how to resolve the problem (some software, a how-to guide or SOMETHING), rather than push it back on the customer to resolve on their own. This really comes across badly to a new BlackBerry customer, who was otherwise quite excited by your product.
Any comments on this or am I on my own?
Simon Edwards
--------------------------------------------------
From: "BlackBerry Support" <help@blackberry.net>
Sent: Friday, November 28, 2008 3:29 PM
Subject: Re: Bluetooth ; RQST00005898259 >
Hello Simon,

Thank you for contacting BlackBerry Customer Support regarding syncing with Broadcom drivers using Bluetooth.
We have determined that you purchased your BlackBerry product through one of our carrier partners.
Your service provider fields general queries and provides technical support for all BlackBerry smartphone-related issues and can act as your first point of contact in these matters.
You may also have the option to receive fee-based support directly from Research In Motion, the manufacturer and wireless experts for the BlackBerry solution. If you would like to learn more about this option, please dial the appropriate telephone number below and enter option 3 in the phone menu to be routed to BlackBerry Customer Care.
If your organization has subscribed to BlackBerry Technical Support Services, please contact your IT department and have one of your named callers contact BlackBerry Technical Support.
Note: BlackBerry Technical Support Services is an annual subscription program providing software maintenance and technical support services for your BlackBerry solution. Named callers are personnel within your organization who are authorized to contact our support staff. For more information on BlackBerry Technical Support Services, please visit:> ....(link removed) - Software Services - Technical Support Services at BlackBerry.com
All BlackBerry smartphone users have free access to the BlackBerry Technical Solution Center. The BlackBerry Technical Solution Center provides a repository of support information, documentation and frequently asked questions, with enhanced search capabilities so you can easily search for and find the BlackBerry support information you need. Please visit:> ....(link removed)
Thank you again for contacting us Simon, and have a great day.
Sincerely,
Patricia
BlackBerry Customer Support
Research In Motion Limited
------Original Message------
Received: Thursday, November 27, 2008 4:57:19 PM (EST)
To: [email address]
Subject: Bluetooth
Hi,
I've just bought a blackberry Bold and wanted to synch with bluetooth. From looking at your site it seems that you insist on using Windows own Bluetooth drivers and not the common Broadcom drivers that came installed on my Dell PC. How come you don't offer support for such a widely used driver?I've tried to uninstall the Broadcom drivers and use the Windows ones but I don't seem to be getting anywhere and I'm worried about the effects on my computer.Dell want to charge me 60 just to tell me how to do it properly! I can't believe there's no support for this and you don't provide a "how-to" guide if you insist on only supporting one driver. Look on all the forums out there - SO many people are complaining about this.
Is there anything you can do?
Simon Edwards

CO_BBTechie 12-04-2008 11:46 AM

Well I hate to agree with RIM, but I do. Would you go to GM directly for a problem with your car stereo? Of course not, you would go to the dealer. Your carrier is your dealer. RIM has no responsibility to service your device or your account.

I do agree that if they're going to allow BT connectivity, it should be more open however. But it isn't. And you won't get anywhere with RIM.

If enough of the carriers complain, they may be forced to do something. But you're not involving your carrier.

Abbsta 12-04-2008 11:59 AM

I purchased the handset without a contract (SIM Free) what then?

My question:
Using XP drivers, I can only sync my Bold..I can't send files etc. Is this a limitation on the Bold's Bluetooth Services or just a driver issue?

CO_BBTechie 12-04-2008 12:12 PM

I believe it to be a limitation of all BT blackberry models, not just the Bold.

And where did you purchase your device? Your marriage is with them. Regardless of contract term, or lack thereof, your purchase and sales agreement is with the entity that sold you the device, not the manufacturer. Unless you purchased direct from RIM.

Abbsta 12-04-2008 12:35 PM

Now that I know that I won't bother searching for dongles and drivers, cheers.

I bought it with no contract from a retailer who buys directly from RIM. So in essence, yes RIM will have to deal with me if there was a problem.

CO_BBTechie 12-04-2008 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbsta (Post 1196088)
Now that I know that I won't bother searching for dongles and drivers, cheers.

I bought it with no contract from a retailer who buys directly from RIM. So in essence, yes RIM will have to deal with me if there was a problem.

Good luck with that. You deal with the retailer who sold to you.

soupandsandwich 12-04-2008 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbsta (Post 1196088)
Now that I know that I won't bother searching for dongles and drivers, cheers.

I bought it with no contract from a retailer who buys directly from RIM. So in essence, yes RIM will have to deal with me if there was a problem.

No, wrong.
Your warranty, or any support, would be provided by your retailer... not RIM.

JSanders 12-04-2008 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbsta (Post 1196088)
yes RIM will have to deal with me if there was a problem.

Sure, at their price for the direct support. That's the agreement you made when you purchased the device from the retailer.

ehartwell 12-04-2008 03:29 PM

Hey! The BlackBerry Desktop Software is written by and owned by RIM, not the carriers. There's nothing your carrier can do about it, except pass on RIM's instructions on how to make RIM's software work:
  • http www blackberry.com/btsc/search.do?cmd=displayKC&docType=kc&externalId=KB04 132
Once you "upgrade" your Bluetooth so BlackBerry Desktop Software works,
  • http serialio.com/support/LaserChamp/3rdPartyRemove.php
some of your other Bluetooth applications may no longer work.

The reason manufacturers use third party driver stacks like Widcomm, Toshiba, and BlueSoleil is that Microsoft provides only partial support for Bluetooth in Windows, so even if they write a Microsoft-compatible driver they can't implement things like Hands-Free Protocol using the Windows Bluetooth stack. Microsoft has better Bluetooth support in Vista than in XP (" it also supports third-party driver development which enables third-parties to add support for additional Bluetooth Profiles"). Maybe Windows 7 will be even better.

In the meantime, it's extra work for a Windows developer to support more than one Bluetooth driver stack. But imagine trying to sell a Windows application that doesn't work on many (or most) Windows PCs...

RIM obviously feels their business is selling phones and services and the desktop software is a bonus they're giving away.

It would be nice if they'd just come right out and tell you that it won't work with Widcomm instead of saying it works with Windows. It would be nice if their tech note told you how to uninstall the 3rd party drivers. It would be nice if they put a little more effort into the Windows side. For now, you're stuck with the USB link.

Abbsta 12-04-2008 04:15 PM

Wirelessly posted

Quote:

Originally Posted by soupandsandwich
Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbsta (Post 1196088)
Now that I know that I won't bother searching for dongles and drivers, cheers.

I bought it with no contract from a retailer who buys directly from RIM. So in essence, yes RIM will have to deal with me if there was a problem.

No, wrong.
Your warranty, or any support, would be provided by your retailer... not RIM.

It depends on the SLA they have with the retailer. There are many brands where you have to deal with directly after purchase.

soupandsandwich 12-04-2008 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbsta (Post 1196426)
Wirelessly posted



It depends on the SLA they have with the retailer. There are many brands where you have to deal with directly after purchase.

RIM isn't one of those brands.

soupandsandwich 12-04-2008 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JessR (Post 1196437)
same with me, I never have good luck with there support

Pay them, and they're unbeatable.

CO_BBTechie 12-04-2008 04:22 PM

Just think of it as pay-as-you-go support. If you wish to bypass all the carrier BS that's your prerogative, and within your rights.... but it WILL cost you. Can you call Microsoft for free?? Can you call Cisco for free? Can you call any number of places for free? No... you cannot. Why expect it from RIM?

carefactornil 12-05-2008 04:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CO_BBTechie (Post 1195996)
Well I hate to agree with RIM, but I do. Would you go to GM directly for a problem with your car stereo? Of course not, you would go to the dealer. Your carrier is your dealer. RIM has no responsibility to service your device or your account.

I do agree that if they're going to allow BT connectivity, it should be more open however. But it isn't. And you won't get anywhere with RIM.

If enough of the carriers complain, they may be forced to do something. But you're not involving your carrier.

If my car stereo wasn't compatible with certain types of CD, yes I would go back to the manufacturer and complain directly as well as tell my dealer/carrier. Apart from apply pressure there's nothing that Orange (my "dealer") can do, they don't make the software, and as I indicated in my email, I had involved my dealer/carrier.

Rather like RIM, I feel you've missed the point of my emails and posting them here. What I would have liked was a more helpful response, and certainly not one that is surely going to cause antagonism. I can sort of understand that their first response *might* be a generic, try A, B or C. But if the person replies saying they've done all of these, what I definitely wouldn't expect is for the next reply to be "your options are A, B & C, here's how to do those again"! It would have been less antagonistic to not reply at all and gives the impression of just some form of automated response, even though it clearly wasn't. And to suggest paying RIM for support - what are they going to do for my money, write some Widcomm patch for me!? Ditto, what would Orange do, they can't change the Desktop software.

At the very least I'd have thought RIM could have said "We understand your problem but we have no plans to make any changes for supporting other drivers and here's the reasons why...". Instead they gave the impression of being a bit like my avatar name, which is what I am trying to highlight to others here.

carefactornil 12-05-2008 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ehartwell (Post 1196340)
Hey! The BlackBerry Desktop Software is written by and owned by RIM, not the carriers.

RIM obviously feels their business is selling phones and services and the desktop software is a bonus they're giving away.

It would be nice if they'd just come right out and tell you that it won't work with Widcomm instead of saying it works with Windows. It would be nice if their tech note told you how to uninstall the 3rd party drivers. It would be nice if they put a little more effort into the Windows side. For now, you're stuck with the USB link.

Hear, hear! (y)

VicF 12-06-2008 11:07 AM

I concur, the bluetooth issue has NOTHING to do with the carrier!

The RIM Bluetooth drivers are incomplete and faulty and RIM KNOWS it; THEY DON'T give a SH.. ! It is really appauling and an insult to it's customers. It is not something their corporate customers are going to make a big deal over so they ignore it.

For those of us on BES we need to try to get our corp people to push RIM, it may be futile anyway since RIM clearly does not care... ARROGANCE in Action !


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