Oh snap, my bad... I though he meant Bush... :lol:

Hey, on a sidenote here... If VZW doesn't have a problem with someone buying an external GPS and using Bluetooth to get it to work with this phone, why bother with disabling the onboard GPS? It's not like they sell aftermarket GPS pucks. They loose revenue that way as well. I guess they are just betting that most of their users don't know you could do that and just do the Zombie thing and use whatever VZW sells them as a service. That's the only logical conclusion I can come up with. But if that's the case, why not leave the GPS enabled and just not preload BBMaps. Let the user figure out they can load up a mapping app and get it to work, it's no different then getting an external puck and doing that. Hummm....

Of course, here's another logical explanation for all this GPS BS. The GPS in the phone was not disabled. The code was rewritten in such a way that it interfaces with their "proprietery" software VZW has for LBS. Because of this rewrite, the GPS in the phone now only works with that.... so basically they had two choices. Recode their software to work with the general APIs of the phone (logical step) or recode the OS to meet their apps needs for interfacing. Hell, maybe the app they use (most likely VZNavigator doesn't even use APIs, it talks directly with the GPS chipset. In some OSs if API are present for hardware control apps designed to interface with that hardware directly cannot access it due to API priority. If the OS was designed this way they'd have to strip the APIs away, which explains why no other GPS app can properly talk to the onboard GPS. Hummm....

OMG enough already

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8830/4.2.2 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/104)

So if I've read all of this correctly, my hard drive has GPS that will help my Yukon get better gas mileage, BUT, if my Yukon gets struck by lightening on a Tuesday then the odometer is crippled?!?!? What the...

I'm going to sue Bill Gates!

why didnt you just return the phone so we would not have to read all your whining?

Verizon does have a return period right?

I needed a freaking Blackberry. Does Verizon make a PDA that has GPS enabled by default? I didn't think so. Changing carriers would not have been an option or did you not get that part already (I've repeated it several times I think.)

Although I agree with you regarding the ad, (I am on ATT), it is alittle deceptive.

rob

I think thats why hes mad test he couldnt return to the store he needed the GPS to find his way back.

LOL

seriously, i guess he is constantly lost without it.


I think he's repeated himself too much...

Cant the mods merge this into the sticky or one of the other threads on this?

That's not the issue. It's a cool capability to have on a phone, especially if it's built in. Why not have it? Did you know the phone can do MMS as well, but that's not available either. Even if GPS was working, I may not even use it that much or at all, but not to be given the option of "self choice" is not cool.

Either we got a lawsuit or the problem doesn't exist. And I don't see a lawsuit...

Wha the h???

Somebody's been repeating something?

I guess I have been too busy sitting here playing with my built-in, enabled, working gps, to have noticed.

Good one.

My view is still that the 8830 is being advertized and sold as a "World Edition" phone. If I buy the VZ Navigator service for $ 10 bucks a month it better work when I am in Europe. Otherwise, turn on the satellite receiver because I got the phone to be used outside of the US on both CDMA and GSM systems.

If the VZ Navigator service does not work outside of the United States and VZ does not turn on the satellite receiver then there is a legitimate reason for legal action. No ifs, no ands, and no buts as this would prove that the 8830 is not a "World Edition" phone and the last time I checked it was still be advertized as such.

I remember the ad and it was the reason I decided to buy a 8830. None of the other Verizon phones mention GPS as it was presented in this ad.

I use Verizon as it is the least worst wireless provider as far as its network coverage is concerned. Hopefully, VZ can prove that they are the least worst in regards to business practices.

If you want to know a secret. Since VZNavigator is an A-GPS app if you're outside the VZW network it won't work. So if you're in Extended network it's useless because the towers won't pass the A-GPS data at all. Nice, isn't it.

So, VZNavigator (A-GPS) on a World Phone =
BBMaps/Google Maps + Enabled Autonomous GPS =
Both would be = , but what's the chance of that happening?

What? There's no GPS on the Verizon 8830????

Whatever. You Verizon Wireless customers are getting shanked.

JRR, where did you get the info that Navigator will only use aGPS?
You other post does not show what it uses, just says the phones contain full GPS and also has the ability to use sGPS. Where are you getting the info on their product?

http://www.blackberryforums.com/gene...-8830-gps.html

Nice, John, let the cat right out of the bag why don't you?

I do not feel shanked in any way what so ever.

The phone has full GPS, but VZNavigator has always been an "Assisted GPS" application. It uses the cell towers to triangulate you for better resolution. Just because the phone has full GPS does not mean it doesn't support assisted GPS... you do know that right?

Shank... it's a verb... you know, "To Shank".

some people have used the argument that verizon advertised it as "built in GPS" and what they really meant was that is has e911 capability. unfortunately "built in GPS" DOES NOT equal e911.

e911 is not a stand-alone GPS technology and requires the use of cell phone towers to triangulate also. cell phone carriers and manufacturer's have stopped advertising "e911 capable" because it's a law that every phone have it now. there is a grandfather rule that older phones activated on an already existing plan do not have to be e911 capable, but any phone activated on a new plan MUST be e911 capable.

back to verizon's advertisement... the phrase "built in GPS" in court would not hold up as being the same at e911 capable. e911 capability has never been advertised by Verizon as "built in GPS" and the term "built in" suggests that its GPS functionality is stand alone and is built into the device. i really get frustrated when people try to say "built in GPS" could be used an excuse for really trying to say "e911"

HOWEVER...with all of this said...if that advertisement was a pre-release and Verizon no longer advertises it like that, well then there is nothing you can do. at least verizon has learned its lesson with the Bluetooth fiasco, when they were advertising bluetooth capability on their phones but they disabled OBEX file transfer but didn't tell customers. now THAT is wrong...

i would like to see Verizon release a firmware update to enable the GPS, even if it's only for VZ Navigator. I know how to hack VZ Navigator and other programs via BitPim and actually use the program for free, so if they only enable GPS for that program...that's fine by me

DING.

Round THIRTY EIGHT.

Nothing below the belt, please.

I'm sorry, but I don't really see the reason for this comment - winking smiley or not.

The mods have WASTED enough time dealing with this single thread, and I for one am sick of it.

Knock it off or the thread will be closed and you can all take a vacation from the forums.

Now I dont see why we all would need a vacation hes the only one throwing licks here. Isnt that a little unfair.

I am actually Highly offened by the comment I am proud of my Irish roots and he really too an unnessecary shot.

Yes of course I do know this. I know nothing about the Verizon Nav program, did not know that it was aGPS only.

Another proud Irishman insulted here as well.

I guess I called that one right.

Back on topic. Is there anything left that can be said about the advertisement in Post #1 and whether it is proof that Verizon advertised falsely?

If he reads this forum he should provide us with insite as to what VZ is planning and maybe answer why you can get six different answers from VZ sales and technical support on this issue.

My comments still stands that if the 8830 is truly a "World Edition" phone then the GPS feature should work outside of the United States still stands and is the only point for legal discussion in my opinion. I forgot to include in my comment yesterday that "World Edition" is silk-screened onto the front of the phone and that kind of makes part of my point in this discusion.

I do not understand why this issue results in name calling. The issue is not between the members of this forum but if VZ can be trusted in the presentation of information on new equipment and if their sales force and technical staff have any idea about what is truly going on. Again, if the President of VZ is reading, please enlighten us as to your view on this matter. This is truly your chance of proving that VZ is the least worst of the majors in regards to business practices.

it boils down to the same issue, "World Edition" can mean whatever Verizon wants it to mean. Kind of like "special Edition" on anything can mean just about anything, or "GT" "LS" can mean anything on cars, no legal repercussions there either.

I've seen a lot of concerns regarding GPS all over this forum. To be honest, I'm not sure folks complaining about GPS lock-out with Verizon have much of a leg to stand on. It sucks, but Verizon has a long-term habit of this stuff. It is what it is.

That said, I'm thinking of upgrading my Treo to the BB 8830. I'd like to do so soon rather than later. The latest word seems to indicate that Verizon will offer its GPS service in October.

Has anyone heard whether Verizon will upgrade existing phones when GPS capability becomes available? Is this in writing anywhere? I'd rather not wait until October to switch upgrade phones.

Now thats not nice, NO one is twisting your arm and forcing you to read this r they?

just like no one is forcing these ppl to buy or use Verizon

how is that not nice?

I think all this thread serves is a place for people to vent about Verizon and for the rest of us to jab at them for venting, endless cycle.

Yup... The last person to post wins!

Yep thats why you have to weigh out whats the right carrier + hardware and go from there

COME on AT&T 8820, yea baby , come on wifi and GPS

Exactly! Today I will contact the lawyers that handled the v710 case.

I understand alot of people are sick of hearing us complain, but seriously after years I am getting sick of VZWs BS. I've tried Cingular and could not stand the service...Verizon has got me there.