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Old 01-17-2007, 03:19 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Sure-Type: Can't properly build/save words as you type?

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Question about Sure-Type

As you build a word you select which combination from the possible choices. In other predictive text software, this is used as the baseline for further entries. With sure-type it appears that it uses this baseline but still allows other permutations that you've already ruled out. I find that on the "signal to noise" scale, this ends up with more noise than there should be. Thoughts?

As an example when I spell "I've" I type i,v, then I select the "iv" combo. I'm telling the software. Ok- we've gone this far. Lets stop and double check our work, calibrate and mesh. This is what I'm after.. got it? Ok. So then I go on to press the "ER" key and see ive & ivr (so far so good...) and then: ice|uce|ucr|icr.... what? I thought I ruled out the "c" combo words?

"I've" is a simple three letter word, but when writing emails with longer words it just adds more clutter and choice to possible selections.

Shouldn't Sure-Type ignore all combinations that you've ruled out by manual selection?
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Old 01-17-2007, 03:57 PM   #2 (permalink)
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to make everything faster go to options/autotext, from there just make a rule from ive to I've.
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Old 01-17-2007, 04:08 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Suretype hint #1 - do not look at the keyboard when you type. Look at the keys and make sure you are hitting the right ones. When you hit the space bar, Suretype will actually help you out. Are and See (same letters) are problems. But I've works.

If you type the correct keys for I've - UI/CV/ER and press the space key it will make it I've. No need for an autotext - it is already there!
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Old 01-17-2007, 04:55 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBlackBerry
Suretype hint #1 - do not look at the keyboard when you type. Look at the keys and make sure you are hitting the right ones. When you hit the space bar, Suretype will actually help you out. Are and See (same letters) are problems. But I've works.

If you type the correct keys for I've - UI/CV/ER and press the space key it will make it I've. No need for an autotext - it is already there!

Actually, on mine pushing that sequence of keys makes "ice" (for some reason this is the primary choice, "ive" is secondary
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Old 01-17-2007, 07:53 PM   #5 (permalink)
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thanks everyone.

These are good tips, but they don't really address the issue that I brought up.

I will admit I was working to learn now to type without looking at the keys. I guess it's generally understood that this makes it easier I can live with it.

Also, I've already built a library of autotext to tweak and tune to my liking. "I've" was just a simple example used for illustrating my point (and mine defaults to "ice" too BTW)

I'm pleased that Sure-Type is working well for everyone. Truth be told, I'm not complaining about it... well I 'am, but I like to think great products can be even better. I just wondered if anyone else thought it was odd that Sure-Type doesn't remember words as you select them from the recommendations. This makes it difficult when backspacing to correct typos and just seems counter productive.
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Last edited by el73 : 01-17-2007 at 07:57 PM.
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Old 01-18-2007, 11:59 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBlackBerry
Suretype hint #1 - do not look at the keyboard when you type. Look at the keys and make sure you are hitting the right ones. When you hit the space bar, Suretype will actually help you out. Are and See (same letters) are problems. But I've works.

If you type the correct keys for I've - UI/CV/ER and press the space key it will make it I've. No need for an autotext - it is already there!

F.Y.I - If you type AS/ER and then space there is a built-in autotext for See.
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Old 01-18-2007, 02:56 PM   #7 (permalink)
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What KILLS ME on the SureType is this one word.

I'm trying to type "he". It comes out as "gr". EVERY SINGLE TIME regardless it is "gr". I tried to add "he" to the custom word list, and it's already there. "gr" is not. WHY does it default to "gr"? How do I stop it?

Same thing when I am typing "guy". It comes out as "hit" every single time even though I use "guy" 55x more than "hit".

I need help.
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Old 01-19-2007, 07:09 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hantra
What KILLS ME on the SureType is this one word.

I'm trying to type "he". It comes out as "gr". EVERY SINGLE TIME regardless it is "gr". I tried to add "he" to the custom word list, and it's already there. "gr" is not. WHY does it default to "gr"? How do I stop it?

Same thing when I am typing "guy". It comes out as "hit" every single time even though I use "guy" 55x more than "hit".

I need help.
Type the keypress combo for "gr" and manually select "he". Do this 3 times in a row. Now "he" will be your default for that keypress combo.

You don't even need to click your heels or anything...
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Old 01-19-2007, 09:20 AM   #9 (permalink)
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SureType is not perfect, but it's honestly VERY quick and a HUGE improvement over other predictive texts found with T9 and other layouts. It does learn as you go, although in your example, without an apostrophe, 'ice' would take priority over 'ive' and I'm not sure if it would ever learn otherwise, no matter how many times you select it. 'i' is the priority letter for UI, obviously. 'iv' takes priority over 'ic'. 'ice' takes priority over 'ive' as 'ice' is actually a word. Hope that makes sense. SureType predictive text works based on complete words not individual letters combinations (so ruling out a letter early on doesn't always mean that it will be ruled out later, especially if a certain key combination completes a word).

I'm not sure if NJ worded his original response right, but I always suggest to look at the keys as you type and not the screen (returning to the 'pecking' style of typing). At some point, when you become more comfortable with it (which I'm sure you're at this point), you'll need to start incorporating the use of the trackwheel/trackball corrections on the screen (such as the 'ice'-'ive' issue).
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Old 01-19-2007, 12:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jibi
...SureType predictive text works based on complete words not individual letters combinations (so ruling out a letter early on doesn't always mean that it will be ruled out later, especially if a certain key combination completes a word).
Thanks...this is where I wanted this discussion to go. Quite simply, I disagree with this philosophy. Of course you have to base it on whole words, I'm not saying that's not the case. But if I've ruled something out already within the first couple of letters, in what cases will I want to see those letters again towards the end of the word? I honestly can't think of why the software continues to recommend a word to me even though I've already told it I'm not intrested in that combination of letters? It comes down to efficiency, clarity, usability, a great user experience (and helping out the user)

Please don't think I'm saying this is hindering my usage or that I'm knocking it. Most of my beefs with Sure-Type come from my own typos and missed key presses, and I'll assume that as I get better with the keyboard (and sure-type library builds) that these issues will lessen.


ps- I undertand about the lower priority of the apostrophe than the whole word but since the comma is a higher priority than the apostrophe, I still have to scroll anyway so why not do it at the end of typing? ...but I get your point.
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Old 01-19-2007, 03:54 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
But if I've ruled something out already within the first couple of letters, in what cases will I want to see those letters again towards the end of the word?
You aren't ruling out 'ic' when you type 'ive' (or 'ice' as it converts it back). You type 'i' and the device selects 'i' for you. You type 'iv' and the device selects 'iv' for you. You type 'ive' and the device selects 'ice' for you. If you actually intervened and ruled out 'ic' from the list, you would have scrolled left or right on the 'iv IV' pop-up and then scrolled back to 'iv', in which case, typing 'e' at the end would be 'ive'. Hope that makes sense. By simply typing on out, you are basing your words on the device's whole-word logic rather than your own personal in-the-process preferences. Once you intervene and make your own selections (which is not what you're doing by keeping it on the defaults), then it stops at that point and tabulates from there to the end.
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Old 01-20-2007, 08:52 AM   #12 (permalink)
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"Shouldn't Sure-Type ignore all combinations that you've ruled out by manual selection?"

Sorry I didn't answer your original question! Sure-Type will give a higher priority to your manual selection, but still wants to leave you with all of your options. Probably does result in more "noise" but if the word you're looking for is in the front of the list, the rest shouldn't really matter anyway. Just helps those of us who tend to make poor choices...

In all seriousness, I think it does a better job if you don't worry about what options it is giving you until you have finished typing the word. In most cases, the word you are looking for will be the default or 1st alternative on the list. Even moreso the longer the word you're entering. Buy/but/bit/nut being a notable exception!!!
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Old 01-22-2007, 08:43 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I guess the utlimate solution to my problem is just to do as you all say and make sure I'm looking at the keys... because when I just wait until the word is all done before I make my selections, often I'm *nowhere* near what word I want it to be....I realize that I probably mistyped a letter somewhere in there, but figuring out *where* is the biggest problem.

jibi- that's not in tune with what I'm describing.. I *am* selecting the "iv" while in the middle of typing... and I used a three letter word for the simplicity of the situation of course.

pdone has a better understanding of what I'm describing. I realize there's a priority to what I've selected, but I just don't know if I agree with it.

So in conlusion?
1) I'll make sure I look entirely at the keyboard when typing. I'm not sure I like that.. that's a habit that I have to break.

2) Hopefully in time, based on number one I'll just let the Sure-Type do its magic and wait until the word is finished. I'll have less typos if I'm doing number 1) so all should be for the better.

Thanks-Eddie
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