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Old 09-17-2005, 02:33 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Electron - EVDO vs Edge

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Does this now make Cingular users like me want to switch to Verizon? Isn't there a huge data rate difference until Cingular does HDSPA? Can anyone tell me what the difference is?
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Old 09-17-2005, 04:15 PM   #2 (permalink)
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i agree EVDO is faster than EDGE but I'm not in the class of people who can afford EVDO. I would have to get it via earthlink if at all. I also have never traveled internationally so don't consider that an issue either.

It is my understanding that if you reseive a call while using EVDO data it would go immediately to voicemail. With my work, calls are important to me and I tend to "play" on my BB a lot...
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Old 09-17-2005, 06:49 PM   #3 (permalink)
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If you are talking about response time on the BlackBerry you'll never notice a difference - I've played with both and they are both screaming. No hourglass clocking; very snappy. Now if you want a card for a laptop, stick with EVDO.
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Old 09-17-2005, 08:32 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default vberry - very interesting

So you are saying on the BB there is so little data that it doesn't matter. That's great news for Cingular users. How much better than the GRPS do you say it is?

Now that I have said that, I am not sure how broad the Cingular Edge coverage is?

Anyone know where a map is?
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Old 09-17-2005, 11:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
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When I was playing with the Edge device, web downloads were about half the time as GPRS (although, i'll admit that I'm pretty happy with GPRS). I know that T-Mobile has a complete overlay of EDGE over it's current GPRS/GSM network and I think Cingular's is the same. I had an in-building deployment of T-Mobile done and the antennas were already EDGE ready - they just needed to turn it on.

What's nice about RIM's implementation is it's backward compatible with GPRS so even if EDGE coverage is week, it'll fall back. Here's some info on Cingular's EDGE network: http://www.cingular.com/midtolarge/edge and here's a link to a map - http://www.rapidwireless.biz/pdfs/GP...rage_10_28.pdf

T-Mobile's map is at http://compass.t-mobile.com
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Old 09-18-2005, 11:33 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Unles you are browsing the web on the BBBrowser which is a clunky browser at best Edge versus EVDO is a meningles debate. Email will continue to roll in at the same speed as always. You browsing experience on EVD will be slightly faster than on edge 2-3 seconds Whoopee.... I'd rather have the edge device on a real network T-Mobile that covers 220 million pops as opposed to evedo which in only 50% built out.
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Old 09-19-2005, 07:31 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I would say it does not matter until the rollout of HSPDA since that will be supposably around 10mbps which is EXTREMELY fast. I think EDGE in real world is a little over 100kb and EVDO ranges to about 200 to 300kb in real world although some say they have hit the 700kb area on EVDO.

EVDO and EDGE would be more benefitical for tethering a BB rather then using its browser.

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Old 09-20-2005, 07:55 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Default So what's the impact on the browser?

I am confused here by the comment about tethering. Will the changes make the Electron a worthwhile modem? Will web pages load quicker such that it makes a difference. For example if I try www.calottery.com which has a bunch of graphics I ususally buy a cup of coffee while it loads. Will this change it to a few seconds.

I realize there will be no difference for email?
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Old 09-20-2005, 09:01 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinsonddog
Will the changes make the Electron a worthwhile modem?
Read my mind. I'm not so interested in faster browsing from my BB but very interested if I can leverage EVDO using the BB as a high speed modem for my laptop (and stop paying the $80 month for the EVDO card!).
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Old 09-21-2005, 10:08 PM   #10 (permalink)
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the 8700 from the box is able to be used as a modem.. no big setups apparently its very easy to setup.
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Old 09-22-2005, 06:42 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregg
Read my mind. I'm not so interested in faster browsing from my BB but very interested if I can leverage EVDO using the BB as a high speed modem for my laptop (and stop paying the $80 month for the EVDO card!).
Do we think EVDO or EDGE will be included in the unlimited data packages by the carriers, or as an additional charge?
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Old 09-22-2005, 10:51 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Even 624 Mhz PocketPC's don't even render WiFi webpages at full breakneck speed. Device performance will probably still be too slow to noticeably differentiate EVDO and EDGE. Browser performance will likely be approximately the same for both with a few seconds faster on EVDO.

You need about 1Ghz of CPU power to realtime render broadband speeds. That's why older Pentium and Pentium II systems tend to lag severely behind modern Athlon and Pentium 4 systems, when downloading webpages over even slower broadband connections. For slimmed down webpages, this does not matter as much, but 300 Mhz and 400 Mhz speeds (if the specifications I am reading on the Net is true, the new 8700 would fall in this range), on top of the usual slowness of Java-based devices, will ensure the bottleneck remains the device.

I agree with most that EVDO vs EDGE will be more important if you are tethering, as the bottleneck is still going to be the device, regardless of what type of handheld device is (PocketPC, Palm, BlackBerry, etc), until speeds gets significantly ramped up.

Granted, EDGE is only barely broadband, but it is broadband enough to be bottlenecked by typical device performance limitations.
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Old 09-22-2005, 11:23 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I'm currently using a Verizon LG VX8000 EVDO phone, and I can tell you there is a huge difference in speed even when surfing wap pages. In some areas near where I live, I get EVDO coverage, and in other areas only 1X. There is a huge difference. In EVDO areas, wap pages load in about a second or two. In 1X areas, wap pages take more like 6-10 seconds to load. Keep in mind that Verizon's Mobile Web 2.0 wap pages have graphics and are rather similar to mobile HTML pages.

I've also played with the Samsung i730 Pocket PC phone in the store and it can load full HTML pages with graphics rather quickly. Yes, it's not as fast as a desktop, but it sure is usable. I did not consider the browser on my 7100g to be usable at all, except for small wap pages. It was way too slow.

As soon as Verizon comes out with a EVDO blackberry, I will probably change back to using one.
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Old 09-22-2005, 12:39 PM   #14 (permalink)
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When it comes to WAP pages, this has more to do with latency. EVDO is much lower latency than 1X.

There is another twist: Even slow GPRS on BlackBerry (slower than 1X) often does initial loads WAP pages faster than 1X when the BlackBerry is transitioning from a not-connected state to a connected state. Most WAP pages take only 2 seconds to load on my GPRS-based BlackBerry 7280, when not bottlenecked by a slow gateway. GPRS connects much faster than 1X, and only needs to idle in an active socket connection in order for phone calls to be received (as long as no data is being transmitted), therefore GPRS disconnection timeouts are unnecessary internally in the BlackBerryOS. 1X based BlackBerries need to timeout/disconnect in order to let incoming phone calls through. At the backend level, it's easier to simulate always-on with GPRS than with 1X because of these limitations.

Also the timeout algorithms (so that the phone can go back into a standby state for intercepting incoming calls) are totally different from cellphone to cellphone. BlackBerries need to simulate always-on, and this is easier to do with GPRS since GPRS does not need to temporarily disconnect like 1X (merely put into a suspended no-transmit mode) in order to listen to incoming calls.

For mass data transfers, EVDO blows everything away though.

Performance considerations are often TOTALLY different on all the technologies:
- Latency of sending the first packet after a long idle (reconnection delay, which is slow on 1X BlackBerries)
- Latency of sending subsequent packets (1X isn't too bad, EVDO/EDGE is better)
- Bandwidth of continuous transmissions (EVDO, no contest here)

Engineers may wish to correct some information, but most can understand that latency is totally different from bandwidth. (Example: Satellite Internet downloads faster than dialup, but latency is worse than dialup) WAP pages are bottlenecked by latency and NOT bandwidth.
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Old 09-22-2005, 03:05 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I use a samsung sch-i730 with EVDO and it was downloading at rates of 50 Kilobytes a second as an usb modem attached to my desktop downloading 10 meg pdf file from a web server. Also used it with wifi in ad hoc mode as wireless gateway for multiple laptops and they were all surfing pretty well. Verizon's EVDO is lit up everywhere I have voice in the Philadelphia Metro area. Which is a big improvement over three months ago where my 45 min train ride was in and out of evdo coverage. It is worth the extra money if you can use it all the time. This eliminates the use of getting an aircard for $60 a month (down from $80) to the pocket pc phone which is $50 a month for the same service on a phone. Getting slower speeds using the bluetooth connection (w/ homebrew addon software) but then you can be untethered and browse from your laptop. We use t-mobile for our blackberries and their coverage is so bad just for voice that a high speed data plan would be useless since you cannot use it most of the time.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:55 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Default EVDO versus GPRS, anyway

I switched from Cingular to T-Mobile recently because my company has stopped supporting "split billing" for blackberry service.
That's where your data bill goes to the company and your voice bill goes to you.

Anyway could be processer differences also but WOW is EDGE faster than GPRS.

As others have stated maybe the blackberry's CPU will be the limiting factor with EVDO but so far anyway better data rates are noticeably improving things.
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:18 AM   #17 (permalink)
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This is a six month old thread!

The wonder of search!
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Old 02-03-2007, 01:59 PM   #18 (permalink)
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6 month old?

Try 1 year and 6 months.
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