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Old 08-02-2010, 03:23 PM   #21 (permalink)
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....And with that we'll move this thread to the Sensitive Discussions.
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:38 AM   #22 (permalink)
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And it looks like RIM caved in.

UPDATE 1-RIM to allow India to monitor Blackberry svcs -report | Reuters
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:04 AM   #23 (permalink)
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There are a few lessons in life that everyone should learn, but many do not. At the top of any list are

Life is too short to drink bad beer or bad coffee

and

The free flow of information and free, uncontrolled, unmonitored communication is always a security risk to utopians, dictators, and monarchs.

I'm disappointed if RIM really has caved.

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Old 08-03-2010, 06:32 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I saw this yesterday, which indicates RIM did not cave....

RIM Tells BlackBerry Users Their Data Are Secure - WSJ.com
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:50 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Sounds like the Wikileaks guy needs to dump a bunch of dirt about UAE and Saudi.
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:44 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juwaack68 View Post
I saw this yesterday, which indicates RIM did not cave....

RIM Tells BlackBerry Users Their Data Are Secure - WSJ.com
The RIM statement that it couldn't access data even if wanted to really only applies to BES, correct?

Also, did you catch the UAE statement that RIM counter offered to share data for 3000 customers? That conflicts with statements attributed to RIM, of course, but interesting.
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:10 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I'm not sure I trust anything UAE says, since it seems their sole purpose in life is to spy on people.
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:18 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Ditto. But if the authorities came to RIM with a warrant, RIM would comply to the extent they could. Problem is in some countries you could end up on one of those warrants just by protesting the actions of the authorities, and be one of those 3000 customers just for being a "troublemaker."
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:45 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Woo hold back on the comments folks.

We live in a volatile world, I don't want to walk into a mall with my kids and boom, and you find out it was all planned through a BB messenger, which the UAE could not do anything about, and I also don't want people reading what I am saying, but that's just the world we live in today. What about heads of the government using a blackberry, would you sleep safe knowing that information is not stored within your own borders?
Doesn't America and UK already have in place laws that cover data being sent out of the country? so why not for all.

RIM to allow India to monitor Blackberry svcs
UPDATE 1-RIM to allow India to monitor Blackberry svcs -report | Reuters

The ramifications for the BB are massive, Dubai airport is one of the biggest in the world, hundreds of thousands of passengers a day, and they wont be able to use their phones..

Anyway back to the topic.

I have two BB's and I love them and the service provided, so much so that I encouraged my family and friends back in UK to sign up to contracts so that we could keep in contact especially through the Blackberry Messenger. If this issue is not resolved thousands of us are up a creek without a paddle basically.
I really hope this issue is resolved quickly, and I think UAE in giving RIM time to resolve the issue they too are hoping for a solution to all of this.
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:54 AM   #30 (permalink)
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My comments are based on what Etisalat did last year with sending out a 'performance enhancement' to their users which really turned out to be spyware.

If they view BlackBerry devices as a security risk, why were they allowed to being offering BlackBerry services at all? Did they not realize how secure they are?

I can understand your concerns about security, we all want to feel secure. However, I don't agree having the government, in any country, reading every little thing I say should be allowed.
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Old 08-03-2010, 09:09 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Christine_P View Post
Woo hold back on the comments folks.

We live in a volatile world, I don't want to walk into a mall with my kids and boom, and you find out it was all planned through a BB messenger, which the UAE could not do anything about, and I also don't want people reading what I am saying, but that's just the world we live in today. What about heads of the government using a blackberry, would you sleep safe knowing that information is not stored within your own borders?
Doesn't America and UK already have in place laws that cover data being sent out of the country? so why not for all.

RIM to allow India to monitor Blackberry svcs
UPDATE 1-RIM to allow India to monitor Blackberry svcs -report | Reuters

The ramifications for the BB are massive, Dubai airport is one of the biggest in the world, hundreds of thousands of passengers a day, and they wont be able to use their phones..

Anyway back to the topic.

I have two BB's and I love them and the service provided, so much so that I encouraged my family and friends back in UK to sign up to contracts so that we could keep in contact especially through the Blackberry Messenger. If this issue is not resolved thousands of us are up a creek without a paddle basically.
I really hope this issue is resolved quickly, and I think UAE in giving RIM time to resolve the issue they too are hoping for a solution to all of this.
Hold back on the comments? That is ironic.

Seems many countries can deal with BlackBerry just fine. It's the regimes that worry about too much freedom that have the problem.

Don't you believe that confidential and secure communication is going to be our undoing. Instead, don't trust those who tell you can't have it because it's for your own benefit.
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Old 08-03-2010, 12:03 PM   #32 (permalink)
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I wonder if the idiots realize that there was terrorism and other bad things before the internet, cell phones and other modern forms of communication. You don't need modern communication to do evil things, and if you were bad and smart you would not use modern communication as it leaves a trail unless your intention was to leave a false trail.

Other interesting issue is if the bad governments can read the communications of their countrymen they likely can read our communication.

Perhaps we should start communicating in code. I think I need to go take a Nixon.
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Old 08-03-2010, 12:10 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Be careful TBOL not to imply anyone here is an idiot. Just FYI how you could be read.

But I was thinking about PGP and its kind. I wonder if encryption software or use of encryption software is illegal in UAE, India, etc?

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Old 08-03-2010, 02:16 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
A day after the United Arab Emirates threatened to suspend some BlackBerry services for fear they are a threat to national security, Research In Motion (RIMM) is taking steps to allay those concerns. First, it released a statement emphasizing its commitment to security.

“RIM respects both the regulatory requirements of government and the security and privacy needs of corporations and consumers,” the statement reads. “RIM does not disclose confidential regulatory discussions that take place with any government. However, RIM assures its customers that it is committed to continue delivering highly secure and innovative products.”

Second, it met with UAE authorities and offered to give them the information they need to monitor BlackBerry services.

“After some persuasion, the (BlackBerry) representative agreed that they can provide the Metadata of the message ie the IP address of the Blackberry Enterprise Server (BES) and PIN & IMEI of the BlackBerry mobile,” internal notes from the meeting reveal. “The concerned internet service provider can also tell the location of the services as well. From these information, the security agencies can easily locate the BES and obtain the decrypted message. They also stated that they have a setup to help the security agencies in tracking the messages in which security agencies are interested in.”

Report: RIM Agrees to UAE Monitoring Request - Yahoo! Finance


Do you think this is true?
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:41 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aiharkness View Post
Be careful TBOL not to imply anyone here is an idiot. Just FYI how you could be read.

But I was thinking about PGP and its kind. I wonder if encryption software or use of encryption software is illegal in UAE, India, etc?

Posted via BlackBerryForums.com Mobile
Just speak in code. What is that smell, who cut an Agnew?

By the way this is an old John Byner joke that was on his TV show years ago. The premise was that you could not use cuss words on TV so he used the name of a famous world politician for various body functions and such. It was pretty funny.

An idiot is someone who thinks they can control people by censorship. Hasn't worked in the past and it will not work in the future.
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:52 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Christine_P View Post
Woo hold back on the comments folks.

We live in a volatile world, I don't want to walk into a mall with my kids and boom, and you find out it was all planned through a BB messenger, which the UAE could not do anything about, and I also don't want people reading what I am saying, but that's just the world we live in today.
Welcome to BBF, Christine.

That line of reasoning could be used to justify all kinds of government abuse. Does your country restrict internet usage by blocking sites or intercepting user data like China, for the sake of national security? Should your home have surveillance cameras and microphones monitored by the government in case someone there is talking about blowing up an airport or government building? Would you think that was ok?

It seems to me the concern about BlackBerry is really more about control than anything else but maybe I am wrong.
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Old 08-04-2010, 07:59 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedin2000 View Post
I seem to remember that it would be possible to setup a BB to 'bypass' the RIM NOC, and connect direct to the BES, but I can't seem to find this now? We looked at it when NTP was looming before. Am I crazy, or does anyone know about this option? Our carrier had told us about it.

It seems that they will block the traffic to the RIM NOC, but traffic to a BES at a random location would likely be able to go through I would think?
Using service routing protocol: BB -> (Wi-Fi) -> Wi-Fi Router -> (VPN) -> Corporate Router -> (LAN) -> BES This is how I get to my BES from home. You don't need a VPN, but the BB has to know how to route to the IP address of the BES. In my case that is a "non-routing" 192.168.x.x address so the VPN tunnel is required.

If you have a supported VPN server: BB -> (VPN Wi-Fi) -> Corporate VPN Server -> (LAN) -> BES

BIS provides no security.
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Old 08-04-2010, 09:01 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Saudi Arabia is blocking BBM:

BBC News - Saudi Arabia announces Blackberry messenger deadline

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Old 08-04-2010, 11:42 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Must be something in the local water. My earlier comment still stands.
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Old 08-04-2010, 06:48 PM   #40 (permalink)
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The ordinary citizens of these countries need to stand up to these dictatorial governments for their privacy rights and the right to use the phones they purchased with their hard-earned money.
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