[rjharary]

Originally Posted by BryanHarig

Apple isnt stupid, they absolutely dominate the mp3 player market now because they offer a complete easy to use solution thats is attractive and well marketed. Every complaint I see about the iphone (not enough features, too expensive, focuses too much on design over practicality) was levied at the original iPod when it came out. Yet here we are today. People dont care about features, they want things that are easy, work together and look nice. Apple knows this very well.

Apples competitors need to learn this and step their efforts up to the next level. If they dont, check back in 5 years and apple will dominate another market.

As for the topic of the thread, hopefully the 91xx series isnt going to be the only HSDPA BB. AFAIK the 91xx will be suretype. Suretype works, but QWERTY is the way a BB should be!

Very very well put! Apple will dominate no matter what, If thier features are lacking, their marketing makes up for it.

[Jagga]

Originally Posted by BryanHarig

Apple isnt stupid, they absolutely dominate the mp3 player market now because they offer a complete easy to use solution thats is attractive and well marketed. Every complaint I see about the iphone (not enough features, too expensive, focuses too much on design over practicality) was levied at the original iPod when it came out. Yet here we are today. People dont care about features, they want things that are easy, work together and look nice. Apple knows this very well.

Apples competitors need to learn this and step their efforts up to the next level. If they dont, check back in 5 years and apple will dominate another market.

As for the topic of the thread, hopefully the 91xx series isnt going to be the only HSDPA BB. AFAIK the 91xx will be suretype. Suretype works, but QWERTY is the way a BB should be!

Somebody doesn't know Apples history too well with consumer products outside of the computer Industry too well.

Out of say almost 10 attempts ... this is the FIRST time Apple dominated the market. Sometimes the technology was WAY ahead of its time, like the PUFF animation we all see when removing something out of the dock in OS X - that was there over a decade ago with the Newton Message Pad.

1. Newton - all editions even that student notebook failed as a dominant product.

2. Digital Camera - yes Apple was an innovator and saw that digital cameras would be commonplace - but they were 7yrs too early and thus failed miserably.

3. Gaming console - the ability to use your gaming console as a communication tool or to watch movies from ... 7yrs roughly too early, failure.

4. Connecting TV from to your computer. This failure wasn't that bad and not Apple's fault. CRT's where not around with the Video class Performa series, their STILL quite good watching TV on if you want it in a camper home/tots room. Just too expensive and the common person was quite confortable watching the BOOB on their couche ;)

5. 20TH Anniversary Mac (TAM) - was actually a HUGE success, and complete collectors item. Absolute thing of beauty and $$$ Expensive. $10k+ originally but delivered by limo to your door in the USA. Innovation extreme ... LCD in a production all in one besides a laptop. 2.1 Speaker system with true BASS woofer courtesy of BOSE. Of Course this didn't dominate either as it was a specialty run. Too costly for the masses & quite honestly too expensive.

Countless others here. So you CANNOT say their destined to dominate the market with the first edition of the iphone. however if they offer unique upgrades and software package upgrades QUICKLY and allow PC users to benefit ... THEN we'll see some market mindshare increase & the followers $$ as well.

3G BlackBerry just needs to continue on OS innovation & faster rendering BB Browser - even modular with OTA adjustments/patches. Better media player is DIRE importance now, not just to the consumer market. Think of BB Maps for a historical site or renowned museum able to be patched into a streaming Audio Book while your on site ... the MAP adjusting with arrows for turn by turn solutions, or even POST a quick animation when you get to specific Hot Points along the map onsite.?! Virtual Tour like what was done on iPods but MORE integral and innovative. Now THAT is worth a patent. Pay up bums ;) j/k - but I like the idea.

[BryanHarig]

Whats the common thread between all 5 of your examples? They are all 5-10 years ago!

If nothing else you can say apple learns from their mistakes and isnt afraid to change. Look at your example #4, now after all these years it is feasable to do and apple just rereleased a much better product.

[jlb]

I will confirm that an HSDPA BB is in the works for Rogers. Maybe even being tested at this moment. They also are working on a BB for Fido that will probably work off of the current EDGE network. All I can say is that the next 6 -12 months are going to be very exciting for Rogers BB customers. I will also say there are new data plans in the works for when HSDPA does come out.

[jetspeedz]

Originally Posted by FLIPP_96

Rumor has it that the 3G HSDPA Blackberry will be an updated 8700 not the rumored 99xx series.

i hope this is true

[archer6]

Originally Posted by Jagga

Somebody doesn't know Apples history too well with consumer products outside of the computer Industry too well.

You are absolutely correct! Kudos for your very accurate and well written post!

Cheers....

[archer6]

Originally Posted by BryanHarig

Whats the common thread between all 5 of your examples? They are all 5-10 years ago!

Yes that's true and History is repeating itself as we speak! As someone who has nothing against Apple other than it's arrogance, I know their history, past & present very well indeed. Also as an Apple customer from time to time, I know full well how they operate and it's not always in the best interest of the customer. More often it's in the best interest of Apple and the customer can buzz off.

Originally Posted by BryanHarig

If nothing else you can say apple learns from their mistakes and isn't afraid to change.

I certainly disagree with this statement. First of all, they do not acknowledge their mistakes under any circumstances. It's against their arrogant "We are the future" culture.

All one has to do, is to purchase a product (Like I did when buying a MacBook Pro) that is defective or has problems. Then suddenly your "Apple Experience" changes for the worse. They have stonewalled every issue with over heating, and the myriad of other problems with the new notebooks over the last year. There is no other notebook maker or seller out there that charges the high premium price of Apple and then delivers such a mediocre product. And do not get me wrong..... I'm not bashing Apple, nor do I have anything against them or I would have not purchased the MBP, or new iPod nano, or 80GB Video iPod. And that's only a summary of new products, I've purchased PowerBooks, and many other Apple products in the past.

I personally think they have squandered many wonderful opportunities in the past which not only limited their growth in the computer market, but ended up nearly taking them out. If not for the wildly successful iPod which brought in enough revenue to save them, the company would be a shadow of it's current self.

Furthermore, if it was not for Steve Jobs brilliant ability to warp the truth and be the charismatic sales person he is , the shift from a company known as Apple Computer would not have morphed into what it is today, Apple Inc, the entertainment company.

The days of the iPod are on the wane and he knows it, thus the last gasp iPhone project. Once again, he's pulled off a near miracle of marketing genius through smoke and mirrors only to cause otherwise normal people to go gaga over some overpriced device that looks like a chrome rearview mirror off an old Ford Maverick.

That said, if this_ iWhatever _it turns out to be, provides some competition for the other much larger mobile phone makers, all the better. It will drive innovation which is always good in a free enterprise society.

[Galvatron]

Originally Posted by BryanHarig

Whats the common thread between all 5 of your examples? They are all 5-10 years ago!

If nothing else you can say apple learns from their mistakes and isnt afraid to change. Look at your example #4, now after all these years it is feasable to do and apple just rereleased a much better product.

archr Apllen never leared for ther mistakes 2O years ago. Remeber the LISA?
it failed misably for 2 resons NO 3rd paty apps or varaiety an it was overpriced even for th business comunity at a wopping $12,000.00
sam aproch 20 years later no 3rd party apps not compatablity and it's overpriced. even FOX news channel an routers have som point on this as wel in greater detail go to Breaking News | News & Media | Latest Current - FOXNews.com wathc the viideo section under busines the clip is called iFlop for apple?

[theBorg]

Originally Posted by BryanHarig

Whats the common thread between all 5 of your examples? They are all 5-10 years ago!

OK, then, let's admit it. @pple TV is a flop. It was supposed to be some big deal to the world too. Factual backup: http://www.contracostatimes.com/business/ci_6092112

I couldn't even read an engineering trade rag w/o hearing about the cute little TV box for months before the release. Where is it now? They can't give 'em away.

The marketing back-peddle they're doing now is hilarious, "Yeah, like, dude, @pple TV is kinda like just a hobby, man. It's like not really meant to be a flagship product."

[King-B]

Originally Posted by Galvatron

archr Apllen never leared for ther mistakes 2O years ago. Remeber the LISA?
it failed misably for 2 resons NO 3rd paty apps or varaiety an it was overpriced even for th business comunity at a wopping $12,000.00
sam aproch 20 years later no 3rd party apps not compatablity and it's overpriced. even FOX news channel an routers have som point on this as wel in greater detail go to Breaking News | News & Media | Latest Current - FOXNews.com wathc the viideo section under busines the clip is called iFlop for apple?

Yeah....I finally understand what you are talking about. Although I dont completely support what you said. I dont think its fair to say that the iPhone, or better yet, Apple is doomed to fail because of its less compatibility. Its like your trying to kill off the little "chu chu train that thought he could..."

[theBorg]

It can be seen throughout human history that closed systems under tight central control don't fare well.

It's not about the little chu chu that could (brilliant reference, King-B), it's about having to buy into a restrictive technology and, in my professional opinion, inferior hardware design. Their AC power adapters with the rotating plugs arc (spark) when they're brand new. You can't change a battery yourself.

That all being said, it's not the quality or feature set of a product that account for much of it's marketability.

[King-B]

Well in that sense, I guess ima finna have to agree with cha.
But if the iPhone ends up being a success, which i do believe, i'm not gonna critize apple for it. The iPhone is cool!!!

Back on topic.......Wont hsdpa drain your battery life? Is RIM up for that challenge. lol.

[fractured]

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8703e/4.1.0 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/104)

HSDPA won't drain your battery life anymore than CDMA does now.

[theBorg]

Wow we have spun off on a tangent!

In any case, if RIM releases a 3G handset with T-Mo, I'll finally upgrade my 3 yr old 7100. This GPRS business is painfully slow for web access.

[Galvatron]

the nokia N95 has an hsdpa an umts radios the specs on it say 120 hours. thats almost 5 days. those ar nokis spece it's afe to say that the battery life on hsdpa wlii be deccent if the battry tech is donew real wel RIM has goood long battery life.

[applerokr]

Rim is rumored to release several new products this summer.
So maybe a 3G GSM handset will be among them.
EDGE is so slow!!

[Galvatron]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.0) BlackBerry8700/4.2.1 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/100)

Well the network spped issue has more to do with the carriers network.

Even readin specs on hsdpa phones like the N95. Nokia speciflicly sated that perfonace issues depend on thae carriers network. Sad how ATT has devoted mor money EDGE reserch. When they could just spend tha money better by upgrading there towers. In a couple of the iphone reviws many had complain on how slow ATT's edge is to verizon and sprints EVDO cankt say I blame them an tmos UK branch alredy has UMTS and HSDPA on ther towers. Everywere In the UK

[applerokr]

Originally Posted by Galvatron

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.0) BlackBerry8700/4.2.1 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/100)

Well the network spped issue has more to do with the carriers network.

Even readin specs on hsdpa phones like the N95. Nokia speciflicly sated that perfonace issues depend on thae carriers network. Sad how ATT has devoted mor money EDGE reserch. When they could just spend tha money better by upgrading there towers. In a couple of the iphone reviws many had complain on how slow ATT's edge is to verizon and sprints EVDO cankt say I blame them an tmos UK branch alredy has UMTS and HSDPA on ther towers. Everywere In the UK

Very true its limited by the network,
however there is a tremendous difference from browsing with a 3G phone and one that is 2.5 G (EDGE)

[Galvatron]

agreed HSDPA is 3.5G Sprin right now is experimenting AND equiping all ther towers with WI-Max wi max is wi-fi-'s basterd cousin in that it tranfers at 100mbps. it also covers the range of a cell network sprint hopes to have all ther tower ready with wi-max by 2010. mean wile att and tmoUS have been siting on EDGE doing nothing when they should be upgrading there towers with HSDPA capabilities. Now suposedly the FCC is suposed to raise the bar on what is considdered "broadband" wich hasn't neen uppd in over a decade fron a speed of 222KBPS HSDPA pulls 1.8 MBPS

[applerokr]

Yeah the FCC needs to get that changed.
However I heard recently that Sprint was having financial issues with the wimax network and were looking into getting a third party.
there are a lot of rumours that they may get bought out anyway.