[Robert_K]

Originally Posted by ArgonNJ

How does me saying that the consumer market is where the money is translate into how well RIM is doing against the iphone?? The consumer market is the brass ring, everyone is competing heavily for this segment. My statement was simple and made no mention of either company's market share in the segment.

My comment was in response to your simple comment that "consumer market is where the real money is" which has nothing to do with comparing iPhone to BlackBerry. That's like comparing apples and oranges.

I was pointing out that your statement is incorrect and sounds downright ignorant considering RIM obtained and still holds a majority of the smart phone market based on the fact that they originally started and still continues to market their product to the business sector not the consumer market.

[ifonline]

After reading several articles over the past two days, it seems the current sinking ship is actually Palm. Analysts are reducing sales projections (bad, considering that sales have been poor already) and devaluing the stock rating. Palms hold on the market is tiny, and apparently app development is weak at best (I don't know, though, as I don't have one).

Sad times. I remember my first PDA was a Palm. I think I might have had almost all of them... Pilot 1000, PalmPilot Personal, Palm III, Palm IIIc, Palm V, Palm Vx, Palm m500, Palm m505, Palm m515, Palm Tungsten E, Palm Tungsten E2, Palm Tungsten T, Palm Tungsten T3 (my favorite).

*sigh*

[Matt_Stevens]

Yes, Palm is suffering and the writing is on the wall.

Now, this thread is HUGE and I am late to it, so I could not read it all, but let me say this.

I live in NYC, a place where there are more Blackberry's and iPhones than on any given corner than one can imagine. Pretty much anyone I know who has an iPhone loves it, but HATES the AT&T service. Why? Because it is s***! Dropped calls (constantly), terrible signal sound and "All circuits are busy" crap just makes it a chore. My wife as the iPhone and talking to her is a royal pain in the rear. My best friend has an iPhone and it's the same. When hje is hoe, he has to stand by the window to talk or the signal is dropped.

My wife and I have many colleagues and friends who jumped onto the iPhone bandwagon, but after their contracts were up, sold the phone and went back to Verizon because of the service. Hell, I know a number of people who want an iPhone, but just won't buy one because of AT&T.

Google's phones have not been the rage Google wanted and they really need to get their marketing and buzz on those products working if they want to be relevant.

Blackberry's Storm was a disaster and because of that, the Storm2 hasn't had the buzz it deserves. To me it IS the iPhone killer. All it needs is a better browser and it's perfect (in my very humble opinion). In fact, when the wife and I went to Vietnam for three weeks she had her iPhone and I my Storm2 and by far the Storm2 impressed people the most. So much so that the bus driver on a tour stole it! The slimy basterd.

I can understand what the original poster was tryint to say. Most people I know whop have a Blackberry or any other phone would like to own an iPhone. But the reasons they don't buy them are, money, AT&T's service, knowing that there is no insurance option for the iPhone from AT&T. Those are the three primary reasons.

That's not to say all Blackberry users want an iPhone. Of course not! I know plenty of Blackberry users who would rather spit on an iPhone than use one. To each their own.

My wife loves her iPhone and wants to upgrade her 3GS to whatever new model (4G?) is next. God bless her. She can do what she wants. Her company pays her bill, so whatever. But I think I will soon be buying her a real crap, cheap and small phone for her to use so we can talk when one of us is away on business. I'll get her on my Verizon account or maybe just do the pay as you go thing. Not sure.

What I am sure of is AT&T is sucks.

[ArgonNJ]

Originally Posted by Robert_K

RIM obtained and still holds a majority of the smart phone market based on the fact that they originally started and still continues to market their product to the business sector not the consumer market.

Had RIM not branched out into the consumer market, I can assure you they would not be #1 right now.

[ArgonNJ]

Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens

What I am sure of is AT&T is sucks.

PCWorld ranks AT&T tops in 3G performance test -- Engadget

[Matt_Stevens]

So what? What does that have to do with poor quality sounding calls, "all circuits are busy" and constant, chronic dropped calls?

Nothing at all.

[kathrynhr]

Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens

So what? What does that have to do with poor quality sounding calls, "all circuits are busy" and constant, chronic dropped calls?

Nothing at all.

Agreed.

[ArgonNJ]

Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens

So what? What does that have to do with poor quality sounding calls, "all circuits are busy" and constant, chronic dropped calls?

Nothing at all.

Originally Posted by kathrynhr

Agreed.

I'm in coastal NJ and have none of those problems with AT&T.

[ifonline]

Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens

So what? What does that have to do with poor quality sounding calls, "all circuits are busy" and constant, chronic dropped calls?

Nothing at all.

Wrong. What it means is that AT&T is fine for most people. AT&T isn't perfect, and obviously doesn't work for you or your friends. But for millions of other people it does work. So I counter your "AT&T sucks" with "AT&T is excellent."

[Matt_Stevens]

If you live in NYC or the part of NC I visit, or the sections of CT I visit, it's complete crap.

[ifonline]

That may very well be true, and I couldn't argue that since I don't travel to NYC, NC, or CT on a regular basis. But there is life outside of those areas, believe it or not.

AT&T used to be fair where I live (just outside Atlanta), but I now (as of a few years ago) have great 3G coverage everywhere I go, and recent 3G SpeedTest results from my phone clocked in at 1.45 Mbps, 1.63 Mbps, and 2.38 Mbps. Not too shabby in my opinion.

Verizon, on the other hand, isn't so good where I regularly travel. T-Mobile is also not too hot, and Sprint is only just bearable. I don't take that to mean that these other carriers "suck." I just take that to mean that they won't be able to service my needs in the locations I frequent.

[Matt_Stevens]

It all comes down to where you are. In the states I frequent only Verizon is any good and believe me, I am not happy about that. I wish to God AT&T or Sprint or somebody else was just as good because then I would actually have a choice. Right now the only cell company I can use reliably is Verizon, which is currently screwing me over big-time on an insurance claim. The rant part of this forum has the thread.

[rambo47]

Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens

It all comes down to where you are. In the states I frequent only Verizon is any good and believe me, I am not happy about that. I wish to God AT&T or Sprint or somebody else was just as good because then I would actually have a choice. Right now the only cell company I can use reliably is Verizon, which is currently screwing me over big-time on an insurance claim. The rant part of this forum has the thread.

Definitely! I'm in northern NJ and AT&T was mediocre to poor for me. I changed to Sprint and can report that service is 100% improved for me. It's all about where you live and where you spend your time.

[TBOLTRAM]

I finally found a place where Verizon 3G service was poor, Greenwood, South Carolina.

[Robert_K]

Originally Posted by ArgonNJ

Had RIM not branched out into the consumer market, I can assure you they would not be #1 right now.

Based on what information? Common sense would show that they #1 before the consumer market took off and still are #1 in smart phone sales because the MAJOR consumer of smart phones is business users.

On the flip side, the dent iPhone made in the smart phone market share would have MUCH more had they not limited themselves to one carrier and my wife and mother would both be iPhone users.

Originally Posted by ArgonNJ

PCWorld ranks AT&T tops in 3G performance test -- Engadget

Who cares. Their 3G network is basically only available in major metropolitian areas and is spotty at best and doesn't make up for their dismal phone service. My BlackBerry is my cell phone first and foremost and a data device second since I do not have LAN line at home. I live in a major metropolitian area and get 5 bars with Verizon full EVDO Rev. A data and the two friends I have who use AT&T can't make a call unless they stand in the middle of my cul de sac. Not to mention the dropped calls. They are so bad in east TN our managers won't even consider them to bid on our cellular contract. On the other hand Verizon is so reliable experiencing a dropped call only happens maybe once in a blue moon. I could probably count on my hand how many times my Verizon phone has dropped a call in the past 5 years not to mention how nice it is to drive 4 hours on the interstate and have 3G service THE ENTIRE TRIP.

So to me buying any smart phone on the AT&T network is like buying a sports car with a bad hesitation that you can only drive fast every other day of the week. I'd rather own a car that works reliably and does 100mph than rather own a car that randomly stops running but is sometimes capable of 150mph.

Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens

It all comes down to where you are. In the states I frequent only Verizon is any good and believe me, I am not happy about that. I wish to God AT&T or Sprint or somebody else was just as good because then I would actually have a choice. Right now the only cell company I can use reliably is Verizon, which is currently screwing me over big-time on an insurance claim. The rant part of this forum has the thread.

Amen, Sprint is the only company being close to as good as Verizon in reliability but their phone selection is lacking. I've already promised my wife if the iPhone comes to Verizon I would swap out her Storm but if Sprint offers it I may be tempted to finally make the switch.

[ArgonNJ]

Originally Posted by Robert_K

Who cares. Their 3G network is basically only available in major metropolitian areas and is spotty at best and doesn't make up for their dismal phone service. My BlackBerry is my cell phone first and foremost and a data device second since I do not have LAN line at home. I live in a major metropolitian area and get 5 bars with Verizon full EVDO Rev. A data and the two friends I have who use AT&T can't make a call unless they stand in the middle of my cul de sac. Not to mention the dropped calls. They are so bad in east TN our managers won't even consider them to bid on our cellular contract. On the other hand Verizon is so reliable experiencing a dropped call only happens maybe once in a blue moon. I could probably count on my hand how many times my Verizon phone has dropped a call in the past 5 years not to mention how nice it is to drive 4 hours on the interstate and have 3G service THE ENTIRE TRIP.

So to me buying any smart phone on the AT&T network is like buying a sports car with a bad hesitation that you can only drive fast every other day of the week. I'd rather own a car that works reliably and does 100mph than rather own a car that randomly stops running but is sometimes capable of 150mph.

Who cares? I care. I live in an area with excellent ATT 3G coverage. I get no dropped calls, so what is YOUR point? If ATT doesn't give you good coverage where you live, then fine, use Verizon. I was pointing out, that where ATT has good 3G coverage, their network is faster. Stop being such a fanboi.

[ArgonNJ]

Originally Posted by Robert_K

Based on what information? Common sense would show that they #1 before the consumer market took off and still are #1 in smart phone sales because the MAJOR consumer of smart phones is business users.

Your kidding right? You're telling me that if BB hadn't reached out to the consumer market with media players, cameras and social networking tools, that they would still be, in a post iphone era, #1 based solely on business users? You must be smoking some good s**t!

[Noodle22]

I'm all for friendly debate, but I'm sick of arguements about carrier coverage. It's different for everyone, depending on where they live! My carrier works great where I live, I've never had a problem, but others have based on where they live. It doesn't make my carrier better, or worse.

And I don't doubt other carriers may have better coverage in other areas.

So can we leave that out of this?

[LunkHead]

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

I wish I were an Oscar Meyer Weiner so everyone would be in love with me, because If I were and Oscar Meyer Weiner then everyone would be in l o v e with me.....

[dc/dc]

Wouldn't you like to be a Pepper too?