BlackBerry Forums Support Community

MadMedik · 01-31-2005, 09:24 AM

Hi all, 1st post here...

Anyone heard anything about RIM releasing an EDGE capable device. I saw one mention of it on Howard Forums, but that was it. Nothing I can find on RIM, on Blackberry or anywhere else. I'm thinking about switching to Blackberry but it means new hardware. I don't want to shell out 500 bones, only to have them release a new unit that can surf 3-4 times faster a couple months later.

MM

T-Roy · 02-01-2005, 02:54 PM

Nothing I've been able to find on the web about a new BlackBerry using EDGE so I would guess there won't be anything for at least a few months.

DrBB · 02-05-2005, 01:14 AM

I doubt it will be very soon. I think we'll see wifi before edge. Just my opinion, though....

guinda35 · 02-05-2005, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrBB

I doubt it will be very soon. I think we'll see wifi before edge. Just my opinion, though....

Sorry for being naive, but out of curiosity, would you please state why we would look forward to having RIM implement EDGE or wifi?

EDIT: did a search as Jibi suggests, and found the following glossary posting by Mark:

"EDGE -- This is an extension to GSM and GPRS for faster data speeds. The principle is the same as GPRS, except data speeds are much faster. Speeds are typically in excess of 100 kilobits per second, and sometimes in excess of 250 kilobits per seconds under excellent conditions. Latency is improved over GPRS. For technical information, see Wikipedia EDGE."

Still don't know how wifi can be helpful to an always on BB.

jibi · 02-05-2005, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guinda35

Sorry for being naive, but out of curiosity, would you please state why we would look forward to having RIM implement EDGE or wifi?

EDGE and/or EV-DO would support faster speeds for data. Look at this as the difference between 56k dialup and DSL/Cable Modem. It would certainly open the door for more capabilities, application functionality, attachment compatibility (bigger attachments), OTA capabilities (possibly), etc. etc. etc.

As for Wi-Fi, its for corporations who already have a WLAN setup. Just imagine a work 'campus' (such as Redmond or government agencies) that has an existing WLAN. You can now use your phone/data service with the BB without making a connection back to a mobile carrier (TMO, etc) - you simply rely on your own resources. This can be very loosely compared to VoIP functionality and how its implemented. bb_tech pointed out in a former thread about the use of Wi-Fi handsets in hospitals (for the employees/doctors) where mobile phones/GPRS is not supposed to be used.

NJBlackBerry · 02-05-2005, 01:39 PM

RIM has been showing the Wifi only BlackBerry for several months. The one I saw was a 7200 sized, blue form factor device, which does NOT have GPRS or CDMA integrated. Jibi pointed out the right thread - the Wifi (which has nothing to do with Edge, not sure where the linkage is) would only be for a corporate WLAN, not to use at Starbucks, or another hotspot.

jibi · 02-05-2005, 01:59 PM

FYI, a 3G Blackberry should be available in Europe/UK this year.

NJBlackBerry · 02-05-2005, 03:46 PM

Don't get me started on 3G. That's just super - now I can watch a movie on my 7100-3G!

jibi · 02-05-2005, 04:45 PM

hahaha. well, its the natural evolution of cell phone networks that North America will likely never see.

...as much as I love the fact that we have free enterprise, I will say that we suck when it comes to things such as internet backbones and cell networks. too many hands in the cookie jar (or honey pot).

Mark Rejhon · 02-05-2005, 05:16 PM

>>hahaha. well, its the natural evolution of cell phone networks that North America will likely never see.

It will arrive eventually, just a six to seven years after we thought it would have arrived.

Okay, it`s arrived in small areas in Verizon territory with their EV-DO and their 2 megabit speeds with about 300-500 kilobits typical speeds.

Ironically, the model 7250 has an EV-DO chip in it, which means that BlackBerry model is potentially the fastest one available. A CDMA BlackBerry faster than a GSM/GPRS BlackBerry, heaven forbid!

I think an EDGEberry will arrive sometime in late 2005. There`s a relatively good EDGE network in Canada right now, although I would not consider EDGE as a true 3G network...

NJBlackBerry · 02-05-2005, 05:42 PM

#1 wireless killer app: voice (mobile phone calls)
#2 wireless killer app: e-mail

Numbers 3-? are still emerging. Wireless Internet is barely there; IM is emerging.

EV-DO does nothing for #1 and #2. 3G does nothing for #1 and #2.

Are the networks giving us solutions for problems that don't exist?

I've used 3G phones. I spend time with Sony and had a video session with someone in Tokyo. Quality was iffy (and I am being nice) and the prices are obscene.

EV-DO is faster than GPRS. I use "fit for purpose" devices and technology; not one size fits all. I have a GPRS BB because it serves my purposes worldwide, and a Verizon EV-DO card for my laptop.

It's kind of like High Definition TV. Eventually, yes. Today, maybe. Definitely not something I need. Even with the SuperBowl tomorrow.

TMPhoneBerry · 02-05-2005, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJBlackBerry

#1 wireless killer app: voice (mobile phone calls)
#2 wireless killer app: e-mail

Numbers 3-? are still emerging. Wireless Internet is barely there; IM is emerging.

EV-DO does nothing for #1 and #2. 3G does nothing for #1 and #2.

Are the networks giving us solutions for problems that don't exist?

I've used 3G phones. I spend time with Sony and had a video session with someone in Tokyo. Quality was iffy (and I am being nice) and the prices are obscene.

EV-DO is faster than GPRS. I use "fit for purpose" devices and technology; not one size fits all. I have a GPRS BB because it serves my purposes worldwide, and a Verizon EV-DO card for my laptop.

It's kind of like High Definition TV. Eventually, yes. Today, maybe. Definitely not something I need. Even with the SuperBowl tomorrow.

I am kind of wondering why the whole IM thing is not that big. I think people will buy devices with just IM and email. Seeing so many IM users on the internet today, I predict it should just be a matter of time.

jibi · 02-05-2005, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJBlackBerry

It's kind of like High Definition TV. Eventually, yes. Today, maybe. Definitely not something I need. Even with the SuperBowl tomorrow.

Hey now, I would not trade in my XBox or PS2 on my HDTV plasma big screen. And the few events that are on HDTV are nice; programming is nice if you like TV (which I do), but still not enough channels on regular cable in my area (Voom looks nice, but too expensive and I do not care to have satellite TV since I have a cable modem as well).

What's the saying about endulging in the non-necessities available...?

:D

EDGE can technically be considered a 'true' 3G network, however its more of middle step between GPRS/GSM and 3G. I would say that EDGE won't catch on in N. America anytime soon (and given the delay in implementing it, it may be skipped for something newer, to be honest).

NJBlackBerry · 02-05-2005, 09:55 PM

And since Voom is being acquired by Echostar and will probably cease to exist in a few months, that's not a viable alternative....

Jagga · 03-16-2005, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon

>>hahaha. well, its the natural evolution of cell phone networks that North America will likely never see.

Ironically, the model 7250 has an EV-DO chip in it, which means that BlackBerry model is potentially the fastest one available. A CDMA BlackBerry faster than a GSM/GPRS BlackBerry, heaven forbid!

I think an EDGEberry will arrive sometime in late 2005. There`s a relatively good EDGE network in Canada right now, although I would not consider EDGE as a true 3G network...

I know you wouldn't consider EDGE a non-3G network; but the 3G consortium does consider it due to its theoretical speeds. Its the "phase/csk" settings providers choose that makes a difference in their speeds.

EDGE also providers more calls & data users per timeslot per tower!!! A significant improvement in congestion on networks especially in the USA with AT&T & Cingular.

I once read an official document (dated 2001) form Ericsson's website stating that W-CDMA/UMTS & EDGE could co-exists but no example is currently existing on any network.

BlackBerry's are pretty fast considering what they do...Web pages are just as or faster than Treo650's (that use EDGE). I wonder how this would help, other than RIM's own employee's in Canada - the execs.

Now 3G/UMTS would be amazing in Europe/Asia as video conferencing seems right up RIM's Corporate aspirations - then again cameras are a no no.

Does anyone got details?

Mark Rejhon · 03-16-2005, 06:13 PM

Jagga - you're right about the EDGE stuff, that the consortium considers it 3G -- though many people have debated it!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jagga

Web pages are just as or faster than Treo650's (that use EDGE)

Actually, that's not apples-versus-apples comparision.

The BlackBerry uses a compressing proxy server (Either BWC/BIS or BES), and downloads compressed versions of the web pages.

By defaut, the Treo650 Blazer browser downloads the full HTML pages with full images, which is a lot more data. However, the Treo650 is faster to compensate for the extra data.

Now, with faster BlackBerries such as 7250, the BlackBerries are definitely noticeably faster than the Treo's doing full HTML.

However, if you sign up for a pay-proxy service that precompresses the webpages, and it's on a really fast server, the Treo650 is MUCH faster than even the fastest 7250 and 7290...

This will change, of course, with the EDGEberry :-D
(Note: I have no information about when one will appear, just that it's natural to assume one should be coming soon enough, now that the best CDMA BlackBerry is using an EV-DO chipset that should be fully enabled sometime in the next few months...)

jibi · 03-17-2005, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon

The BlackBerry uses a compressing proxy server (Either BWC/BIS or BES), and downloads compressed versions of the web pages.

This is not all that uncommon, though. To be honest, assuming the requesting device had the power, I think compression is the best method for surfing, whether it be on your handheld or your home computer.

I do not know how the RIM compression proxy works, or its method of delivery, but you see this technology in place on just about any place that you visit nowadays (or atleast, people should start implementing it). For instance, this forum comes with gzip enabled, assuming that the server supports gzip. All that does is compresses the requested data via gzip then transfers it to the requesting user/device. The requesting browser then decompresses that data, renders the pages and displays. With the power of computers these days, the end-user will see no delays with displaying - and many times will see nothing but improvement in delivery. All that and it saves a buttload of bandwidth for the site owner/administrator. Another example of compression is the 'download accelerators' for dial-up users (NetZero or Netscape Internet, for example).