[FroogleThis]

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8703e/4.1.0 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/104)

Bring on the firing squad!!!

Actually it's possible (and far more than likely) that someone on this thread uses both a PC AND and Mac for design. This person also very well may work with people who have been designing for print since 1973!

[davistld01]

I got a new 8800 today...and had a brief BIS issue with my switching from my 8300 Curve to this new phone, and went to my favorite smartphone-Superwoman AT&T sales rep at my local store (she's smart...and hot!). As she toiled away, on the phone first with AT&T and then with RIM...I spent the time playing intensely with an iPhone.

After almost an hour of play...I made a decision. I don't want one. At least not now...or until some "polishing" is done by Apple.

I much prefer my BlackBerrys...the 8800 and the 8300.

Case closed.

Now...if the smartphone-Superwoman wasn't engaged. The world would be more perfect...

[Alex Alexzander]

Originally Posted by FroogleThis

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8703e/4.1.0 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/104)

Bring on the firing squad!!!

Actually it's possible (and far more than likely) that someone on this thread uses both a PC AND and Mac for design. This person also very well may work with people who have been designing for print since 1973!

From 1984 to 1986 I worked in Lithography and commercial art. I can absolutely tell you that PostScript, the Macintosh, and the LaserWriter changed everything.

But I can also tell you that today, the Mac or the PC both can create the same stunning art, equally with ease. The Mac is no better than the typical PC is today. Sure you claim there is spyware. I use NOD32. It's very light weight, updates automatically, and doesn't even both my Avid. Spyware, Viruses, etc, can all be managed, and it doesn't take a lot of effort to do so. The one catch to that statement is you need to be reasonable. I do know folks that just fire up the Peer to Peer software, steal everything in sight, and end up with malware on their machines. Since 1991 I have been building my own PCs to suit my needs, and I have yet to ever get a single virus.

In 1977 I owned an Apple IIe. In 1992 I had a Performa, which is Mac Classic. In 1996 a PowerCenter 150, which was a Mac clone. From 1999 to 2004 I owned basically every Mac model made during those years. I still use a Dual 1.8 GHz G5 at work for Quark. I have 4 computers at work that I use because of what I do. One is an Eclipse for pre-testing DVDs. One is for my regular uses of email, word, outlook, etc etc. Then I have a few which are attached to several DLT drives that I use for pre-mastering, and for copying.

In 1994 I certified as a CNE. In 1997 I certified as an MCSE. 1998 I certified as both a Lotus Notes Application Developer, and a Lotus Domino Administrator. In 1999, I certified on Sun Microsystems as an Enterprise Engineer. In that same year, I helped a company bring to market, the first SAN storage arrays after having worked with Compaq Storage systems for years. I was Senior Analyst for Winstar, and later Director of Engineering. But during all of this, and since 1996, I had a passion for video and art, and used my own income to learn Adobe Premiere, Photoshop, Illustrator and so on. And so when I saw the change to ditch high-tech for creative work, I took it.

I can honestly say I see both sides of the mac and the pc debates. I've had to master more software than most will ever have to think about. How many in here know what a super block is? I bet none. I bet all are looking it up on google. In 1981 I even wrote a BBS, and a terminal application for the commodore 64, in Blitz Basic. How many know what Punter Protocol is? Or even XMODEM, or Y-MODEM-Batch? I bet Google doesn't even have Punter Protocol. Or what about APL, the programming language? It's been dead for 20 years. But I bet you have heard of COBOL. Perhaps even Logo.

If you're a Mac user, you likely assume those that do not like Macs are ignorant of Macs. Well, I'm not ignorant of any computer made today, and I don't care for Macs. And I don't care for Apple either. I believe the customer ought to be able to open the box, pull out the power supply, run to the nearest electronics store and buy a new one, and then repalce their bad one and be up and running just like that. That's the PC. And it goes on and on. Motherboards, lots of video cards, lots of everything, and it's all up to the customer.

I could have spent $4,400 on a basic computer for my Avid Media Composer. But instead, I built a dual XEON Nocona, with RAID, an nVidia FX 1500, which is what Avid wants, and it works very well. I saved over $2,000 by doing this. And I gained something else money can't really buy. The ability to fix my own machine. When I have a problem with a PC, I know I will be back up and running within an hour. I know because I built it, and I know that the worst possible problem is a complete CPU or Motherboard failure, and I am ready to fix both.

The PC I use for design is a dual core Intel Core 2 Duo. I'd say it cost my $1,100 to build it, but I was one of the first people to buy a Blu-ray burner, which was $999 when I bought it, so that raised the price up. But consider this. Apple still doesn't sell a Blu ray Mac, and I been burning Avid dailies of HD footage to Blu ray discs for close to 7 months. I don't have to wait for Steve Jobs to decide he wants to do Blu ray. The second Pioneer released the drive, I bought one, and since I am a reviewer and know folks at Sonic, I was already in the know about when we'd see Blu ray authoring software released.

That's the PC. It's choice.

Now, I could go on about the Mac too. When I was buying those, I would tell folks you buy a Mac because you have better things to do. You buy it, it works, you move on. And for those that feel this way, it's a valid argument. In most cases, you plug it in, and it just works. But to say things like the Mac is better at creative stuff, is flat out wrong. It's not only no better than a PC, it's not as good. And before you call your Mac clan to help you argue with me, read my reason for saying this. What is the premier 3D app for game development? 3D Studio Max. It's PC only. Is Adobe FrameMaker a Mac app anymore? No. What are most Avid customers using, a PC or a Mac? Well, when Apple decided it needed only 3 slots, Avid up and left, as Avid needed more slots than that to work, and since then, more Avid customers use the PC, and it's an example of how Apple will shoot themselves in the foot because of design stupidity. They wanted 3 slots, and the folks doing real pro work needed more. Did Appel care? Heck no.

What's the minimum Mac you can buy with PCI slots? The Tower, right, come on admit it. So to get slots, you must pay a minimum of $2,499. What's teh cheap-o PC selling for with PCI slots? I think we both know it's about $399 and up. Why does that matter, you demand? Well, as I said, I do pre-mastering. It's a seriously pro function, and guess what it requires? A PCI slot, a SCSI card, and old fashion DLT drives. If I wanted to do this on the Mac, I'd have to buy a Tower, an ATTO SCSI card, which are over $500. And then the DLT I can do the same function on a PC for under $500 in total! That's a huge difference. The PC world simply has options that cover every possible need at every price level, and that is in the best interest of the consumer.

Macs have Office, and so do PCs. But we also have Word Perfect. That was killed on the Mac. You have Final Cut Pro, and we both have Avid. We both have Adobe Premiere Pro. We can both use the same AJA and BlackMagic cards, so no real difference there. We can both edit film and video. We both have Photoshop, and the whole rest of the suite, but the PC has the whole Cold Fusion dev tools. The Mac doesn't. The Mac doesn't have Flame, Inferno, Flint, or DFX+. No AutoCAD, the #1 CAD by far. I'd say building a building is pretty creative.

So the Mac user in you wants to say, we can run windows, so we can do all that too. When the second you do run windows, you really running a PC. Same PC hardware I have, and the same OS. You're not really running a Mac anymore. You'd be running yet another PC, which only shows my point, that anyone, even Apple, can build a PC, and that's what makes them great.

What has this got to do with the iPhone and the BlackBerry? Well, the BB is like the PC. I can buy 3rd party apps, and extend the functionality of my Blackberry. Can you do that with your iPhone? No. You're going to be limited to the web apps, which is really kind of lame, and the developers agree with me, so stop apologizing for Apple. Great experience is impotant. I get that. But the phone is a tool, and the customer is not a baby. If I run into an app that's bad for my Blackberry, guess what, I erase it. Jobs says he is worried about stability. Well, that's what RIM, Microsoft, and so on deal with every day. If Apple is so great, why can't they deal with what we deal with and make it work the way everyone else makes it work? They sound like chicken-sh!ts to me.

I'm closing in on 40 years of age. I don't need Apple to baby sit my use of a telephone. If you feel you need that, then hey, that's your business. But I'll take choice every time.

-Alex

[lineus]

Looks like programm for iPhone unlocking is already around

http://nanocr.eu/2007/07/03/iphone-without-att/

[Alex Alexzander]

That link didn't work for me.

These hackers are getting pretty darn fast though.

Best,

Alex

[TBOLTRAM]

One of my friends at work got an iPhone last weekend after he saw my 8830. He went to Verizon and talked to them and then went to the local Apple store and got the iPhone instead. My impressions:
1. The display is very good although I did not see it outside. The 8830 display can be seen in bright sunlight.
2. I did not like the keypad.
3. When the iPhone was accessing the internet over the WiFi in the building it was very fast. When it accessed the internet over the ATT network it was rather slow.
4. Using the email function is a bit complicated compaired to the 8830.
5. He was looking for something to access the internet to see sports scores. For the intended purpose I could not disagree with his choise assuming he is near a WiFi connection.
6. Phone service was no better or worst than expected with a modern cell phone.

I intend on finding out how long his battery lasts with his extended internet usage and how well the data connection works out in the field away from WiFi. Also I will find out how well his email works in practice.

[*&))]

I came from AT&T and i would never go back, not only that i have not found a smart phone that had a feature that my blackberry could match, and i think that this is the case here. Yes while the media side of the iphone will be stronger, i don't really use my phone for that type of deal, but i don't see the other side of the iphone handling all that well. And i have used just about every smart phone on the US market and a few other and nothing made me want to give up my blackberry.

kind of funny as soon as i got done posting this my wife walks in with a new iphone she got Monday (its funny how she buys things with out telling me and theres no problem but when i do it she flips out), she likes it, but i'm not all that impressed, and i could never use the keyboard on it, i have a bad habit of texting while driving and this wouldn't cut it for me (don't try this i live in the middle of no where can the worst that can happen is I'll run into a ditch)

i have come to the conclusion blackberry wins for me iphone great mainstream media lovers(it does not take video, that blows) not for anyone who loves push mail. And i just love my 8830 its the best thing since sliced bread

[Alex Alexzander]

I'm actually surprised so many people are interested in portable media devices. Even Steve Jobs said a few years ago that he felt that no one wanted to watch a video on a small screen. He made that comment when he was asked if a Video iPod would ever see the light of day.

I personally asked a few Treo owners less than a year ago if they used their Treo for media. The answer I got back was that people used it as a Phone and an email device, and felt that media would drain the battery, leaving the phone useless, which was un-acceptable. So a media player with combination phone was still out of the question it seems.

Remember the Motorola ROKR, which also died on the vine. An early attempt to mix an iPod and a cellular phone. I rarely see folks watching the video iPod. So a lot of opinion from the general public suggested video, music, and smart phones were not a function folks were interested in.

In hind sight, perhaps no one was able to show it off well enough until Apple created the iPhone. That being said, the UMD still comes to mind. Video playback on the Sony PSP device should have been sure thing. A 4.4" screen, plays video games, so you have that whole demographic. It plays UMD movies, and it has WiFi, web access, and even displays photos, and plays MP3s. The package itself is pretty darn nice too. I bought one of those the day it released.

UMD was so popular, you could, and likely still can, buy virtual any new release on the format. Every studio supported it, but about a year after UMD released, it started to die down. And again, we're talking a 4.4" screen. Good games that kids like, such as Tomb Raider: Legend, and Outrun are available. And becuase it's a WiFi device, it can play over a network. I am pretty shocked the PSP isn't doing much better. And I keep thinking it is under $200, and it given all that it can do, it shoudl sell more. But perhaps folks are more interested in communication that games. If so, that's a good thing.

I'm very curious to see if the iPhone gains like the iPod. Will it get stronger as the future unfolds, or will it die down, and become less in demand? Will it carve out a new consumer base, and overtake the volume sold to business customers, or will it be a niche?

Interesting times ahead.

-Alex

[dvaskelis]

For those that are interested in a little bit of iPhone on your BlackBerry, download the 24 ringtones here: iPhone 1.0 Ringtones (click on "Download file")

They are M4A (MPEG-4/AAC Audio) files, and play without conversion on my 8830. They are all 128kbps or 192kbps bit rate, 44.1kHz or 48kHz sample rate, and most are stereo but a few are mono.

Like most ringtones on the 8800/8830, they're a bit quiet and could be louder as ringtones, but play at a decent volume in the Media Player.

[test54]

I have my video ipod and use it all the time. I only watch it on the screen when traveling. Works very well on the train or plane as its very easy to load movies or podcasts. Usually movies for long flights -thanks handbrake-.
Everyday use is usually either putting it on at the gym while on the bike or treadmill. Also use it to watch my video podcast with the video out option, very easy to hook up to tv and as long as you use the right format it looks good on tv. - this is especially good for some hard to find tv shows (Top Gear and other BBC and English shows).

Just find it easy to use and I will watch when traveling. I know the iphone does not have video out and that was a disappointment to me but at 8gb its not really big enough to compete with my ipod. However its screen is definitely much better and bigger.

[benisntfunny]

Opening day I went out and bought an 8GB iPhone. It reminds me of some of the girls I pick up from the bar. It was hot but got annoying quick .

- Email was hell if you have lots of messages, also add in the fact that the email client crashes.

- Safari was garbage in my personal opinion... I liked how during Steve's keynote he kept mentioning to developers they could do just about anything because it was a "full version of safari." This couldn't be further from the truth with its inability to save content you see on it, use java or flash.

- Running all your addon applications from safari is stupid, especially given how unstable it is. I just want to install applications and ruin my phone, can't you let me do that Apple? It's my $651.43 after all.

- YouTube was neat.

- Outlook through IMAP, how great. No address book or calendar synchronization.

- "Nicknames" from Apple address book work in the address book portion but not in text messaging. For example if I type "Liz" in my text messaging because i've put it for Elizabeth's nickname it won't show up.

- Text messaging is annoying, looks like iChat. While I don't really like iChat at least it lets me choose not to have childish chat bubbles all over my screen. I like to chat in plain text please.

- Google maps is extremely limited. Forget the fact that you don't have GPS, you also can't select alternate routes (Avoid Highways) and no access to "My Maps" which doesn't work in Safari either.

- External speakers are junk, sound terrible and distorted at higher volume levels.

- No longer worked with my car iPod connection. Well it did, it played music and acted fine but it no longer charged and the phone eventually just died.

- Address book requires too much work to call a contact. I cannot just scroll to a contact and simply call them i must first go into their information and select the phone number I wish to call, even if they only have one number.

- Can't save anything to the phone from Mail, can open word docs but can't edit them.

- Hard to text while not perfectly still. I had a difficult time as a passenger in a car because of the vibrations moving my fingers around the glass.

- Adding songs must be done through a playlist rather than ad-hoc dragging to the iPod as previous ones worked.

- Doesn't work with iSync which would allow me to wirelessly sync my contacts to the phone and calendar events. it would also let Address Book do pairing with the phone to display incoming calls on my screen. I think it's a big "duh" that this should work with iPhone, it's Apple's OWN application.

- Phone is difficult to use with one hand.

- Rejecting a recommended word can be tricky if you're not paying attention. You may end up with words apple thinks you want to spell because when you press the space bar they get implemented.


Anyway...
I returned my iPhone. I absolutely hated it, the more I used it, the less I liked it. I had every intention of going back to my E62 so I headed over to the cingular store to restore my old plan and get a new sim card for my phone... but when I got there I had to wait around for awhile and figured I'd try out a Blackberry...

I've never had one before but I picked up the 8800 and a BIS (BES is just too expensive and really, I don't want my corporate email bothering me anyway). I've got to say I've been really impressed. This is probably one of my favorite phones I've ever owned. I enjoyed the E62 but this is MUCH quicker. It's not as Mac friendly as I'd like but I can deal with that, since I have a PC as well.

I think I liked my Blackberry within the first 20 minutes of use, and now I've owned it for a little over 5 days and I just keep liking it more and more. I guess the iPhone would be cool for anyone who really doesn't have any serious work to do and is not a power user.

[jetspeedz]

Originally Posted by FroogleThis

That is a ridiculous, short-sighted response, which clearly was not thought out prior to posting. Apple's are around because they are the design standard.

So, while we speak arrogantly (and in ignorance), I'll just tell you to keep making your spreadsheets with your PC, and I'll keep "avoiding spyware".

By the way, that Blackberry you're using isn't Windows. You sure it's not proprietary mentally going to kill itself?

Typical answer from a Mac follower...

Keep using your Mac buddy and spending the extra $$$ so you can take your junk to an Apple store for repair b/c we all know Mac users don't build their systems.. they pay the extra dollars for apple to do it... You gotta love the dual boot too since Mac is so great why the need to run Windows on Apple !!!
your posts like so many Apple die hard users i know always give me a good chuckle... Anyway no need to get into a piss match b/c narrow minded Apple users like yourself only see things from one side so ill end it with that... have a good day... Thanks

Read Alex's post i don't think i could have put it any better myself with some of his statements http://www.blackberryforums.com/gene...tml#post588578

[FroogleThis]

Originally Posted by jetspeedz

Typical answer from a Mac follower...

Keep using your Mac buddy and spending the extra $$$ so you can take your junk to an Apple store for repair b/c we all know Mac users don't build their systems.. they pay the extra dollars for apple to do it... You gotta love the dual boot too since Mac is so great why the need to run Windows on Apple !!!
your posts like so many Apple die hard users i know always give me a good chuckle... Anyway no need to get into a piss match b/c narrow minded Apple users like yourself only see things from one side so ill end it with that... have a good day... Thanks

Read Alex's post i don't think i could have put it any better myself with some of his statements http://www.blackberryforums.com/gene...tml#post588578

Yes, Alex's post was similar to the way our older Art Directors feel. I'm not saying a PC is completely incompatible with design, because that would be a lie. I was pointing out your narrow-mindedness. To keep this short, and as mature as possible, I'll just try and clarify a few of your statements.

1. I have owned 4 Mac's, across a few generations, and worked on many more (not nearly close to Alex's history). I have never, I repeat NEVER, had to take any of my Apple computers to the store, other than to pickup a keyboard that a bum friend spilled beer on. I hate the Apple store-- except for the one time I had to take my iPod for service. I had just purchased it, and the stupid thing just stopped working (despite many attempts to fix it). I was able to return it, and take that $300 back home.

2. Of course I didn't build my system. Why on earth would I need or want to? To call it my own? My work speaks for my capabilities-- not my Mac. I am by no means a die-hard Mac user, because I usually have some flavor of Windows next to me.... For testing purposes. It's not my fault Microsoft hasn't released a new Office for Mac Application in 3 years! I am required to double check that my work maintains quality across all platforms, and since Powerpoint's most recent release in Windows-only, I am required to use it. Please, tell me why in the world I would pay ANY amount of money for a computer, only to build it myself? I focus my time on things that I'm good at, and enjoy. I'll leave it to the company I'm purchasing my computer from to send me what I need. Sure, there were many add-ons such as capture cards and RAID/SCSI controllers, but I prefer to stick to the vendors I trust.

3. Why dual-boot on Windows? Gaming? Database applications? Who knows. There's a host of reasons, and I can only name a few. I personally use a Windows machine for testing, that's all I need it for.

4. Don't throw stones at a glass house... We are both narrow minded. You call Mac's junk when you've never actually owned one (I'm guessing here...). I call Apple's the design standard because, in the world I work in, it is. We have a phenomenal IT staff here, and two of them have even switched to the MB Pro (and yes, they obviously have to dual boot).

Honestly, it's all about preference. I find that Mac's suit my lifestyle and work load. I make the financial sacrifice to save the time and risk of building a comparable system. Judging by your responses, I suspect you are a bit of a gamer, most likely young, and you probably have no need for a Mac. That's fine, but don't speak to something you only have an opinion on. Calling anything you've never owned "junk" is lame. It would be like me, having never owned a bike, to call the bike in your avatar junk "because a few friends say it sucks".

And, I wouldn't buy the iPhone. Blackberry has never let me down.

[someonexh]

Originally Posted by jetspeedz

Typical answer from a Mac follower...

Keep using your Mac buddy and spending the extra $$$ so you can take your junk to an Apple store for repair b/c we all know Mac users don't build their systems.. they pay the extra dollars for apple to do it... You gotta love the dual boot too since Mac is so great why the need to run Windows on Apple !!!
your posts like so many Apple die hard users i know always give me a good chuckle... Anyway no need to get into a piss match b/c narrow minded Apple users like yourself only see things from one side so ill end it with that... have a good day... Thanks

Read Alex's post i don't think i could have put it any better myself with some of his statements http://www.blackberryforums.com/gene...tml#post588578

had to chime in here. I love getting into the mac vs. pc discussions at work also. Why do mac users constantly have to defend their systems.. I love the spyware / virus crap, it's just like firefox. When 90% (if not more) users use windows on a PC, why would you code something malicious to only attack a small userbase?.. just like firefox... of course there is no hacks / bugs really in it.. when almost everyone uses IE .. no one cares enough about firefox enough to do anything.

[Alex Alexzander]

Originally Posted by someonexh

had to chime in here. I love getting into the mac vs. pc discussions at work also. Why do mac users constantly have to defend their systems.. I love the spyware / virus crap, it's just like firefox. When 90% (if not more) users use windows on a PC, why would you code something malicious to only attack a small userbase?.. just like firefox... of course there is no hacks / bugs really in it.. when almost everyone uses IE .. no one cares enough about firefox enough to do anything.

I'd have to agree with you. Viruses are written for the PC, because it's an attractive target. I've done my share of laughing at Microsoft for being a magnet of sorts to virus writers, and sometimes it's a little fun to kick them, as they tent to get on my bad side over licnese issues. But in all honesty, no one really knows how Apple would respond if in the same situation. Apple has the luxury of being so small, that no one wants to hack spend the time creating tools to expose holes in their OS. It's pure marketting FUD that they are more secure by design. They are more secure by condition, not design.

I hate to quote lines from movies, but here is one for you anyway. "It would be like going out of our way to destoy some ant hill in Africa". Why would you do that? Why would you care to do that. The answer is, you wouldn't. But look at Safari for Windows. Within hours of it's release, that supposed secure code was exposed to have all kinds of security flaws. That's because we have tools on Windows that are mature, and good at exposing holes. No one writes these for the Mac. But imagine if Safari is typical of Macintosh programming, then I think it's safe to assume we'd find lots of holes in other areas across the Macintosh if these tools were available for that platform.

So a Mac user would counter; it doesn't matter how we are secure, just that we are secure. I have to disagree with that line of logic, because the minute you kid yourself that you are secure, you assume no one "can" break in, when in reality it's merely a case that no one "cares" to break in. And that's not a good situation. It's lasted a long time, I'll agree to that. But it doesn't mean the door is locked securely. The door is fact open. No one cares to enter is all. For your sakes, I hope that remains true, I'd hate to see the platform go through all of this. But the more Mac users throw it in the faces of the world, the more some nut is going to decide to make himself a name by exposing the Mac and all its holes. By saying it's so secure, you're creating a challenge to the population, and one of these days, someone will rise to it, and then Apple and their limited resources, will have to deal with. And remember, we're talking about resources stretched so thinly that Apple had to stop development of OSX in order to make their ship date for the iPhone. If Apple was hit with security issues on the same level as Microsoft, I honestly doubt the new OS would ever come out unless their increased their staff, and thus costs might have to raise.

-Alex

[benisntfunny]

Originally Posted by someonexh

had to chime in here. I love getting into the mac vs. pc discussions at work also. Why do mac users constantly have to defend their systems.. I love the spyware / virus crap, it's just like firefox. When 90% (if not more) users use windows on a PC, why would you code something malicious to only attack a small userbase?.. just like firefox... of course there is no hacks / bugs really in it.. when almost everyone uses IE .. no one cares enough about firefox enough to do anything.

I guess it's because that's an easy poke at the PC world. While YOU might not have viruses, spyware, etc the average computer user who doesn't know much isn't always as fortunate. Your average user is going to be all cool like the guy in the previous post and say "Oh Yeah I use NOD32"... no.. they use their crap free trial of McAffee and let it sit on their desktop telling them it's expired without a big clue what to do about that.

I'm not sure what you're talking about with the Firefox argument either, Spyware can be contracted through Firefox, it's just easier on IE.

Anyway, I usually only feel the need to "defend" my Mac when people talk overly ignorant about them. I usually don't point to the security differences as my reason for choosing Apple. I typically buy Apple laptops as well so anyone's argument about "building your PC" is pretty much bunk. When was the last time you built your laptop from scratch?

I use a Dell laptop at work, I have a newegg-parted-out computer at home and my MacBook. Using my MacBook has nothing to do with computer ignorance, I'm very well versed in both operating systems. I just prefer the programs mac developers write and the operating system itself.

Miranda IM is not the same as Adium
Launchy is getting there but it's still miles away from the functionality of Quicksilver
Growl... hell even some of the more simplistic things like the IRC client Colloquy. They're just applications you don't find on PC and when you do they're bastardized copies who go far to make the application look the same but work very much different.

I also like the keyboard shortcuts better on Apple.

If I had any real big complaints about my Mac it would be the lack of effort attributed by big software vendors to write good software. Photoshop has been junk in my opinion all up until CS3, all those Adobe (Macromedia Products) are horrible when compared to PC, Office on Mac sucks though there was a time it was decent... the list for that kind of stuff goes on and it's frustrating at times.

Luckily as I've said before there are a lot of third party developers that do a phenomenal job filling the gap where big companies have left off. They usually also do a better job with their approaches. The smaller people fall short though when it comes to continuous updates and what not. These guys aren't developing for the enterprise.

As much as I like Apple, I can't imagine using it enterprise wide at any company. That would be the largest headache ever. That's too bad really.

[FroogleThis]

Originally Posted by someonexh

had to chime in here. I love getting into the mac vs. pc discussions at work also. Why do mac users constantly have to defend their systems.. I love the spyware / virus crap, it's just like firefox. When 90% (if not more) users use windows on a PC, why would you code something malicious to only attack a small userbase?.. just like firefox... of course there is no hacks / bugs really in it.. when almost everyone uses IE .. no one cares enough about firefox enough to do anything.

For the same reason die-hard PC users fail to read things thoroughly before entering a PC-vs-Mac debate. The whole "Mac's have no viruses" thing is an automatic offensive strike from PC users, or from what I call the "Starbucks-n-Mac" user. I never claimed the virus-free defense, because despite the assumptions by jetspeedz, I am not a Mac-or-die user. As I've stated multiple times, I use both platforms extensively, and sometime simultaneously. I simply prefer Mac for my work. No Font-to-Printer conflicts, no need to purchase OTF font's to avoid WinPS issues. It's rather irritating to be stereotyped simply because of my preference, as if I didn't really have valid reasons to back my preference. If you're going to stereotype me into the same category as that annoying cat-glasses, Starbucks drinking, Mac laptop-for-internet-only user, then I'm going to stereotype all PC users as 75 year old grandmothers, who's identity could be easily stolen because they don't know how to properly use a computer.

Firefox does have a small bug. It's more resource intensive, and often runs at 170k. Also, if you load Java pages, the application uses even more resources, and you have to completely shut down the program and restart for Java to finally be shut down.


EDIT: Thanks benisntfunny. Great post.

[jewberry]

Originally Posted by benisntfunny

I guess the iPhone would be cool for anyone who really doesn't have any serious work to do and is not a power user.

What kind of 'serious work' can you do from your blackberry? LOL!

[benisntfunny]

Originally Posted by jewberry

What kind of 'serious work' can you do from your blackberry? LOL!

At the very least have access to exchange server (address book and calendar too), edit word documents, save files to a memory card, and have some sort of disk mode for transferring files between machines.

That's just off the top of my head. I'm sure there's a lot more I could think of.

[someonexh]

Originally Posted by Alex Alexzander

I'd have to agree with you. Viruses are written for the PC, because it's an attractive target. I've done my share of laughing at Microsoft for being a magnet of sorts to virus writers, and sometimes it's a little fun to kick them, as they tent to get on my bad side over licnese issues. But in all honesty, no one really knows how Apple would respond if in the same situation. Apple has the luxury of being so small, that no one wants to hack spend the time creating tools to expose holes in their OS. It's pure marketting FUD that they are more secure by design. They are more secure by condition, not design.
-Alex

Well said!

Originally Posted by benisntfunny

Anyway, I usually only feel the need to "defend" my Mac when people talk overly ignorant about them. I usually don't point to the security differences as my reason for choosing Apple. I typically buy Apple laptops as well so anyone's argument about "building your PC" is pretty much bunk. When was the last time you built your laptop from scratch?

I don't really attack, it's normally a defense when they mac user tries to do the spam / virus attack on me I then will bring up how software shopping is in the end.. to each his own.