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Old 06-15-2011, 11:27 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Question Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

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I have a Cysco N Router at home, a Dlink G Router at the office and a Dlink G router at a friend's home.

I have a BB 8900 with latest OS and a BB 8520 with latest OS. Both are on the Rogers Network in Edmonotn AB.

The 8900 connects to WIFI at all three locations and shows UMA. If I disable the Mobile radio, I still show a connection thru to Rogers via WIFI/UMA and am able to make calls, etc.

The 8520 connects to wifi in all three locations but NEVER shows UMA.

MY wife has an 8900 and there are several instances where hers doesnt either.

I have no special BB plan and none of the phones subscribe to the special UMA service from Rogers. (Used to be "at home") forget what they call it now.

Any ideas on troubleshooting this?
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Old 06-16-2011, 09:17 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Really? Nobody else has two or more Blackberries that exhibit this?
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Old 06-16-2011, 11:02 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Are they all Rogers branded?
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Old 06-17-2011, 10:05 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

I have a Rogers 9780 unlocked running 6.0.0.461 and for the first time since I bought it in December it is showing UMA. I have made no changes to any of my setup in months so I'm not sure what is going on.
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Old 06-17-2011, 03:24 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

My BB8900 and my wife's BB8900 are both Rogers unlocked. The 8520 is an unlocked Fido running on the rogers network.
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Old 06-17-2011, 03:44 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Only the Rogers branded devices will get UMA. The fido device will not have the proper uma profile for Rogers.
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Old 06-17-2011, 03:51 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Thanks John. I wonder what I can check to allow my wife's BB to show UMA. Very often hers will show EDGE when mine is showing UMA. This is at home on our own router.
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Old 06-17-2011, 03:54 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Probably has to do with the router. What kind of router and is its firmware up to date?
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Old 06-17-2011, 04:03 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

It is a new line Cysco N and has the latest firmware. As I mentioned, my 8900 gets uma without fail. So I don't think its that. I get UMA all over the place when travelling, but hers is rarely showing UMA.
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Old 06-27-2011, 11:58 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Clark View Post
Probably has to do with the router. What kind of router and is its firmware up to date?
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Interesting... He has two of the same model BlackBerry from the same carrier, and one of them connects UMA while the other one doesn't - and you say it's probably the router? C'mon, John, that's pretty lousy troubleshooting!

Are both of the 8900's running the same OS version?
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Last edited by DallasFlier : 06-27-2011 at 12:00 PM.
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Old 06-27-2011, 01:33 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Um, no its NOT lousy troubleshooting but thanks for your opinion. I have had the very same problem with a Linksys wrt54gs router that wwould work fine with one BB connected but when I tried to connect a second it would drop the first. After much troubleshooting, thinking it was a device problem what finally fixed it was loading dd-wrt on the router (essentially a new/different router). It is imperative that the router have its firmware up to date and even still problems can arise from certain routers.

I have two Dell D820 laptops. They have the same wireless cards in them. One connects to my Linksys router just fine. The other drops the connection quite often. Turns out its a known problem between Linksys routers and this particular Intel wireless card.

So, its not uncommon to have problems with certain routers that seem like they are device problems.
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Old 07-27-2011, 02:52 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Clark View Post
Um, no its NOT lousy troubleshooting but thanks for your opinion. I have had the very same problem with a Linksys wrt54gs router that wwould work fine with one BB connected but when I tried to connect a second it would drop the first. After much troubleshooting, thinking it was a device problem what finally fixed it was loading dd-wrt on the router (essentially a new/different router). It is imperative that the router have its firmware up to date and even still problems can arise from certain routers.

I have two Dell D820 laptops. They have the same wireless cards in them. One connects to my Linksys router just fine. The other drops the connection quite often. Turns out its a known problem between Linksys routers and this particular Intel wireless card.

So, its not uncommon to have problems with certain routers that seem like they are device problems.
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John, I know you've been one of the most helpful folks around here for many years, and are respected for the time and assistance you have and continue to provide. So, I kind of hesitate to argue with you - but as a very experienced electronics engineer with years of experience - no, THIS problem can't hardly be the router. I'm very well aware of the WRT54G(S-L) line, and DD-WRT (and Tomato, which I run on mine as well as several others I've setup for family/friends.) I'm also well aware of the compatibility issue with certain Intel wireless chipsets (addressed by certain versions of both DD-WRT and Tomato, albeit with certain tradeoffs if you need to support those Intel chipsets.) If one of your laptops is frequently dropping connection, and has one of the particular models of Intel chipsets, then you need to load a DIFFERENT DD-WRT version to fix that issue. The fact that one of yours connects fine and the other does not is likely due to different revisions of the chipset itself, even though the adapter model may be listed as the same for both.

He didn't say when his wife's BB connected that his dropped (like the problem you mentioned.) He said his his connects AND provides UMA (at multiple locations, using different routers by different manufacturers), while his wife's also connects but does NOT provide UMA (also at multiple locations.) Now good troubleshooting technique is to try to substitute different components to narrow down and isolate the problem. If substituting the router for a different one solves the problem, then its appropriate to point fingers at the router. If, however, substituting the BlackBerry (like him effectively substituting his for his wife's) solves the problem, then the problem almost assuredly lies with the device which will not properly operate. The next question I'd ask, is what version of the operating system is each of the two (same model) BlackBerry's running? That should help to narrow it down further. Substitute - isolate - narrow the problem. He's substituted routers (says his BB works with ALL the different brand routers at different locations.) He's substituted devices - HIS work, his wife's does not. That pretty much narrows it to a device problem with his wife's device (BB.) To narrow it down further, check software differences on the two devices. He said his 8900 has "latest OS" but didn't mention whether his wife's does or not. That's the next question to ask.
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Last edited by DallasFlier : 07-27-2011 at 02:56 PM.
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Old 07-27-2011, 03:09 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Ok, after reading through the thread I see what you are talking about. I posted that from the mobile forums and likely didn't read enough.

I actually answered the OP's question but he asked it again anyway. I post to other forums too and likely thought I was answering a different question than that of the one here. Regardless, my mistake.

The answer to the OP's question is that an unlocked FIDO device will NOT connect to UMA on Rogers or any other network other than FIDO (if they even had UMA.) I said this in post #6. Changing the OS will not do anything, either. The FIDO device will not have the proper UMA profile set up in the engineering screens. It is possible to add UMA functionality to an unlocked device from another provider but it requires techniques that are above most people's ability. That said, if you think it is within your ability I have written posts on adding TMobile UMA capability to other branded devices. For example, I have an ATT branded Torch and I have to complete this process each time I upgrade the OS on it. See the post here:

Get Your Unlocked 9800 Torch Working on TMobile with Browser, UMA and DM Tethering

I'm sure there is info out there on where to get certificates for Rogers and the proper Rogers server info to enter in the Engineering Screens but I don't have that info off hand.

I hope this clears it up.

Last edited by John Clark : 07-27-2011 at 03:12 PM.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:15 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Clark View Post
Ok, after reading through the thread I see what you are talking about. I posted that from the mobile forums and likely didn't read enough.

I actually answered the OP's question but he asked it again anyway. I post to other forums too and likely thought I was answering a different question than that of the one here. Regardless, my mistake.

The answer to the OP's question is that an unlocked FIDO device will NOT connect to UMA on Rogers or any other network other than FIDO (if they even had UMA.) I said this in post #6. Changing the OS will not do anything, either. The FIDO device will not have the proper UMA profile set up in the engineering screens. It is possible to add UMA functionality to an unlocked device from another provider but it requires techniques that are above most people's ability. That said, if you think it is within your ability I have written posts on adding TMobile UMA capability to other branded devices. For example, I have an ATT branded Torch and I have to complete this process each time I upgrade the OS on it. See the post here:

Get Your Unlocked 9800 Torch Working on TMobile with Browser, UMA and DM Tethering

I'm sure there is info out there on where to get certificates for Rogers and the proper Rogers server info to enter in the Engineering Screens but I don't have that info off hand.

I hope this clears it up.
Well, now we're talking about two separate things - two different questions the OP actually asked in the thread. He mentioned three devices:
Quote:
Originally Posted by richdocekal View Post
My BB8900 and my wife's BB8900 are both Rogers unlocked. The 8520 is an unlocked Fido running on the rogers network.
Your original answer, which you expanded on now, is succinct and 110% correct:
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Clark View Post
Only the Rogers branded devices will get UMA. The fido device will not have the proper uma profile for Rogers.
Posted via BlackBerryForums.com Mobile
What I'm speaking of is his other, related question - the two 8900's which are both Rogers - one of which always connects with UMA (multiple, different brand routers at different locations) and the other one which connects WiFi but not UMA (again, tried at multiple locations on different routers.) That's the issue which pretty much has to be a device issue - either hardware or software (OS) issue.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:31 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Same Router - Two Blackberries - One UMA and One Not ??

On mine I have to set it to WiFi preferred to get UMA.
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