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Old 09-17-2008, 01:02 PM   #1
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Default Globe & Mail article blaming iPhone for AT&T's delayed launch of the Bold

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Interesting perspective:

globeandmail.com: U.S. iPhone traffic clogs RIM's Bold plans
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Old 09-17-2008, 01:22 PM   #2
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big surprise. more problems caused by the iphone. does apple test before they put it into prod or do they just think making something look pretty will excuse it?

thanks apple for breaking att's network and delaying devices that actually work.
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Old 09-17-2008, 01:48 PM   #3
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From the article:

"AT&T will need to spend as much as $1-billion (U.S.) to repair its network"

LOL. They get what they deserve. And to think the 3G iPhones use all that bandwidth and still can't deliver usable sound quality on a simple phone call (at least that is the case with iPhone users who call me). I can always tell when an iPhone user is calling me.....because these are the only people who say "can you hear me now?"

Still, they are a cool fashion accessory, and good for lots of stuff except making phone calls.
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Old 09-17-2008, 01:57 PM   #4
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I have not heard of similiar issues within the Rogers Network Infrastructure with the iPhone though.

--Phil
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Old 09-17-2008, 02:39 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Medic48 View Post
I have not heard of similiar issues within the Rogers Network Infrastructure with the iPhone though.

--Phil
That is really interesting. I wonder if it is just volume related. Maybe there are far fewer iPhones operating on Rogers and/or Rogers had a higher available capacity to start with. Or it is a combination of these two factors. I remember when AT&T first switched over to GSM, the service was terrible. But eventually they ramped up the capacity and now it is really good. I just thought AT&T's 3g had been in place long enough to have sorted this type of thing out.

Also, doesn't Rogers impose quota's on its data plan users? This would have a big impact on keeping bandwidth available. AT&T, as far as I know, does not impose any limits on iPhone users, so they are free to hog all the bandwidth they want without any drawbacks.
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Old 09-17-2008, 02:40 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Medic48 View Post
I have not heard of similiar issues within the Rogers Network Infrastructure with the iPhone though.

--Phil
that just might be Canadian efficiency tho.
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Old 09-17-2008, 03:07 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RadHaz75 View Post
big surprise. more problems caused by the iphone. does apple test before they put it into prod or do they just think making something look pretty will excuse it?

thanks apple for breaking att's network and delaying devices that actually work.
Ha

Please explain how AT&T's poor excuse for a 3g network is in any way Apple's fault? AT&T has been pinching pennies when it comes to upgrading to 3g for years now.

Once iPhone made mobile data usage simple and usable for the majority of real consumers (as opposed to techies) guess what? Their bargain bin 3g network couldnt take the load!

Is that what you blame Apple for? Making data so widely and easily used?
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Old 09-17-2008, 03:14 PM   #8
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This article is hilarious:

Quote:
...
lso, whereas BlackBerry data traffic is channelled through RIM's servers, the iPhone utilizes a "ping-pong" technology which must constantly access AT&T's network in order to receive data and e-mails, placing a great strain on the telecom company's cellular infrastructure.
...
Sending data back and forth without backend servers that compress that data????

My god that is just like every other mobile device and computer ever made except for the BB and the Sidekick!!

Give me a break.
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Old 09-17-2008, 03:55 PM   #9
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This is likely the problem that I was referring to in earlier posts. I suspect we have the same issues here on Rogers but just not reported yet, or possibly delayed Canadian complacency.

Either way I have a question- I use a 3rd party BES server. Would that you be slower than a direct RIM BES or a corporate BES? Every time I try and load a web page the longest part appears to be the 'requesting' part.

Am I being overly critical? If so, that's ok!
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:16 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BryanHarig View Post
Ha

Please explain how AT&T's poor excuse for a 3g network is in any way Apple's fault? AT&T has been pinching pennies when it comes to upgrading to 3g for years now.

Once iPhone made mobile data usage simple and usable for the majority of real consumers (as opposed to techies) guess what? Their bargain bin 3g network couldnt take the load!

Is that what you blame Apple for? Making data so widely and easily used?
This is an interesting take on the issue. One could argue that Apple dumped an inefficient device onto the market. But what is beyond any debate is that AT&T put millions of these inefficient devices into their customer's hands without first upgrading their network to support the new bandwidth-hoggers. That is purely on AT&T, not Apple. And AT&T should have known what the usage characteristics of the iPhone were well before they deployed it. I assumed that they would have upgraded the network first, then released the device. Instead, it appears they did the opposite.

How does this sound for a company philosphy:

"Thanks for giving us all of that money, which we will immediately book as a profit.....we promise to have your problems fixed at some point in the future"

Unfortunately, AT&T is not a pioneer when it comes to adopting this philosophy.

And ironically enough, in the end, we BB users may have the iPhone masses to thank. AT&T is now going to have to do a major infrastructure upgrade as a result of these folks, but we will also benefit from it.
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:28 PM   #11
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Clearly an ATT issue to me. My Iphone with the new 2.1 update is rock solid.
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:29 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BryanHarig View Post
This article is hilarious:



Sending data back and forth without backend servers that compress that data????

My god that is just like every other mobile device and computer ever made except for the BB and the Sidekick!!

Give me a break.
Yes, with the following notable exceptions:
  • The iPhone enables users to transmit a much larger volume of data than "other" devices that use the 3g network as their primary means of connectivity
  • "Other" devices, like PC's were not designed from the ground up to utilize a mobile network. The iPhone was.

It makes sense, that when you are designing a handset that is going to use huge volumes of data, you might consider a concept like data compression at least equally to something like an accellerometer that lets you shuffle your music playlist in a neato way Then again, I am not an engineer.
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:56 PM   #13
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While I agree that building some kind of data compression into iPhone (perhaps like that built into Opera?) would have been helpful there are certainly additional costs and tradeoffs involved in providing for that.

HTC, Palm, Samsung, Motorola et al do not support a back end infrastructure to compress data for the carriers. Why should Apple be criticized for following their lead here?

The only device makers that do provide such an infrastructure are RIM and Danger. And arguably saving bandwith was an after thought when implementing those systems, it was more about security and convenience in my opinion.

AT&T failed to plan ahead and failed to invest enough into their network. Now they are victims of "their" own success. (I say "their" because iPhone is selling in spite of AT&T, not because of them. Apple is doing most the work when it comes to marketing)
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Old 09-17-2008, 07:51 PM   #14
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I posted about this weeks ago in the bold and att thread and nobody responded. lol It was told to me in so many words the network just had to many users on it. Its that simple nobody thought they would sell that many iphones at once.
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Old 09-18-2008, 03:25 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BryanHarig View Post
Ha

Please explain how AT&T's poor excuse for a 3g network is in any way Apple's fault? AT&T has been pinching pennies when it comes to upgrading to 3g for years now.

Once iPhone made mobile data usage simple and usable for the majority of real consumers (as opposed to techies) guess what? Their bargain bin 3g network couldnt take the load!

Is that what you blame Apple for? Making data so widely and easily used?
What I understand from the article is that Apple's phone does not compress data, as Rim's does, and that Apple does not have servers to serve its units, again as Rim does. So yes, it is Apple's fault that its phones are hogging ATT's capabilities, a fault which is technical in nature, and not one of popularity.
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Old 09-18-2008, 03:36 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guinda35 View Post
What I understand from the article is that Apple's phone does not compress data, as Rim's does, and that Apple does not have servers to serve its units, again as Rim does. So yes, it is Apple's fault that its phones are hogging ATT's capabilities, a fault which is technical in nature, and not one of popularity.
Read post #13.
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Old 09-18-2008, 05:16 AM   #17
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Tell me why again GSM is so much better then CDMA. You don't hear about these problems with Verizon's and Sprint's 3G networks.
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Old 09-18-2008, 05:17 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BryanHarig View Post
Ha

Please explain how AT&T's poor excuse for a 3g network is in any way Apple's fault? AT&T has been pinching pennies when it comes to upgrading to 3g for years now.

Once iPhone made mobile data usage simple and usable for the majority of real consumers (as opposed to techies) guess what? Their bargain bin 3g network couldnt take the load!

Is that what you blame Apple for? Making data so widely and easily used?
Agreed. I think AT&T is as much or more to blame for this debacle then Apple.
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Old 09-18-2008, 07:49 AM   #19
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Clearly AT&T infrastructure issues will not be resolved before releasing the Bold. I can't imagine that it would be released if it was going to have the same issues with call dropping and poor email like the iphone. Obviously that would greatly impact RIM's strong image of reliability and security and would not be agreeable to RIM. It will be interesting to see if the Bold will be plagued as well by the supposed AT&T issues. Tragic for RIM in their biggest market if that is the case.
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Old 09-18-2008, 12:03 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArgonNJ View Post
Tell me why again GSM is so much better then CDMA. You don't hear about these problems with Verizon's and Sprint's 3G networks.

Better coverage. GSM prodomitly runs throughout Europe and South America while CDMA is very localized and not world wide supported.
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