[jaymacwade]

I just spoke with someone at T-Mobile Customer care, and everyone insists that WiFi won't work at all without a data plan.

HOW DO THEY GET AWAY WITH EXTORTION LIKE THAT ?!?!?!?!

According to them, you can't even use your own WiFi network without paying them to use their GPRS network, too!

I even specifically asked about the "Blackberry Enabler" add on. The rep. I spoke with said that had nothing to do with WiFi, but was related to picture messaging (and something else that I have forgotten now because I couldn't care less about either one).

All I want to do is use my own (or other available) WiFi network to send and receive email and browse the web (and avoid carrying a separate phone). I did not realize when I bought the Curve that it was crippled!

If I had known then what I know now about the WiFi capabilities of the Curve, I would have saved my money and bought an iPhone!! I still hate the on-screen keyboard, but at least it doesn't require a monthly fee to allow the WiFi to work!!

D*MN! I hate the U.S. mobile phone industry !!!

GGGGGGGRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[John Clark]

So, another rant because someone didn't do their research on the device before purchasing.

You CANNOT do push email on a Blackberry without a BB data plan....even with a wifi BB.

You can use a wifi BB with no data plan if you just want to surf the web. With TMo's feature enabler, you will get IM which includes BBMessenger which needs pin messaging enabled. That's all you get, though.

Next time do the research. Enjoy the iPhone.

[freddymcfredfred]

Originally Posted by John Clark

So, another rant because someone didn't do their research on the device before purchasing.

You CANNOT do push email on a Blackberry without a BB data plan....even with a wifi BB.

You can use a wifi BB with no data plan if you just want to surf the web. With TMo's feature enabler, you will get IM which includes BBMessenger which needs pin messaging enabled. That's all you get, though.

Next time do the research. Enjoy the iPhone.

..or because BB does marketing like a boot. I don't need to read tons of posts just to understand if an advertised feature (wifi) is fully supported by the advertising manufacturer. Btw, when I asked this question to RIM, as a prospective potential customer, I got a marvelous answer: I can get an answer from them only if I pay for support. Wow.. This is the first time I hear about this kind of "wild wild west" type of respect for a potential customer.

[John Clark]

Blackberry doesn't market these. The carriers do. If your carrier can't solve your issue, they will escalate you to RIM....that doesn't cost anything to you. If you call RIM directly, yes, they charge you.

[jaymacwade]

Originally Posted by John Clark

So, another rant because someone didn't do their research on the device before purchasing.

You CANNOT do push email on a Blackberry without a BB data plan....even with a wifi BB.

So, … another dismissive post from someone who didn't read the post fully and decided to show it by posting a hot response.

I never said anything about push email.

Originally Posted by jaymacwade

All I want to do is use my own (or other available) WiFi network to send and receive email and browse the web

For email, I want to use an imap client. That way, all of my mail stays on the server, and I access it there when I have WiFi available. I might also want to use the Yahoo application to get my Yahoo mail, or see a map of an address in my contacts (with either BBMaps or GMaps), or use a decent browser like Opera Mobile!

What valid reason could the carrier have for locking out these features other than emptying my wallet? This might be worthy of a class-action lawsuit if enough people feel as cheated as I do.

As for doing the research, here are the limitations stated on BlackBerry.com:

Check with your service provider for supported services and features. Not all BlackBerry plans support Wi-Fi access to BlackBerry services.

Does that even begin to accurately describe the limitations of this device? Since when does access to my own WiFi fall under "BlackBerry Services?

If you can answer that, I'll apologize profusely for the rant. Otherwise, just let me vent a little, eh?

~ j.

[John Clark]

Originally Posted by jaymacwade

All I want to do is use my own (or other available) WiFi network to send and receive email and browse the web (and avoid carrying a separate phone). I did not realize when I bought the Curve that it was crippled! ....

I read your post.

[John Clark]

Applications need to have permissions from the OS (built by RIM) in order to access any data, be it TCP, GPRS or WIFI. Not all those apps have access to the wifi data yet.

You didn't do your research. Sorry, the device isn't what you thought it would be.

[Berry One]

Originally Posted by jaymacwade

I just spoke with someone at T-Mobile Customer care, and everyone insists that WiFi won't work at all without a data plan.

Define 'not work,' please. If all you need is access to your own WiFi you do have it: just configure blackberry WiFi connection to your router and it should connect.

As a verification, check WiFi router logs: it should show device connected. Check Options/Status on your device and you should see IP address, from the range your wireless router allocates.

That means, your device did get TCP/IP connectivity to the router. Feel free to use WiFi.

HOW DO THEY GET AWAY WITH EXTORTION LIKE THAT ?!?!?!?!

They may not have had clear understanding of how blackberry works. You have gaps in that knowledge, too - and this is not the reason to scream at them (or at you).

According to them, you can't even use your own WiFi network without paying them to use their GPRS network, too!

You can. If you disable blackberry firewall you should even be able to ping device from inside your network, I think. In any case, your WiFi network can be used.

All I want to do is use my own (or other available) WiFi network to send and receive email and browse the web (and avoid carrying a separate phone). I did not realize when I bought the Curve that it was crippled!

For this you have two options: use RIM services and pay for services, or find third-party applications written for blackberry that use WiFi TCP/IP connection and do not use (do not pay for) RIM services.

WiFi is just a transport. It is like complaining that you moved from dial-up to broadband and still for fee Web sites do not let you in.

If I had known then what I know now about the WiFi capabilities of the Curve, I would have saved my money and bought an iPhone!!

There is usually 30 days return policy.

I still hate the on-screen keyboard, but at least it doesn't require a monthly fee to allow the WiFi to work!!

BlackBerry does require monthly fees to use RIM services. Your WiFi connectivity between device and wireless router should be working without paying monthly fees.

[John Clark]

Excellent explanation..

[jaymacwade]

Originally Posted by Berry One

Define 'not work,' please. If all you need is access to your own WiFi you do have it: just configure blackberry WiFi connection to your router and it should connect.

I was just relating what I was told by the T-Mobile rep. In my experience, the WiFi works even if you don't have a SIM card in the Curve, but only with the built-in browser. No other application works with the WiFi. That seems to be the experience of most other users posting on this forum, too.

… you have two options: use RIM services and pay for services, or find third-party applications written for blackberry that use WiFi TCP/IP connection and do not use (do not pay for) RIM services.

As for applications that use the WiFi connection, from other reports on this forum, it sounds like any of the available apps can use the WiFi if you purchase a data plan, but if you don't have the data plan, nothing but the built-in browser works.

BlackBerry does require monthly fees to use RIM services. Your WiFi connectivity between device and wireless router should be working without paying monthly fees.

While I can connect to my own access point and browse (using the built-in browser), none of the other applications can use the WiFi, even though it is connected. I am told that purchasing the BlackBerry data plan unlocks this, but no one has yet even attempted to justify the fact that it is locked in the first place.

This conversation has prompted me to go back and look again at LogicMail. The latest version appears to work a little better than the version that I had, but I still get a lot of "Unknown Errors" when downloading certain messages. However, the fact that it works at all seems to confirm your assertion that applications can be written to work around T-Mobile's seeming lock on the WiFi connection.

If everyone had to "do the research" like this, no one would every buy anything because by the time the research was complete, the item would be obsolete and no longer available.

Frustrating !!

~ j.

[coreyg510]

Originally Posted by jaymacwade

While I can connect to my own access point and browse (using the built-in browser), none of the other applications can use the WiFi, even though it is connected. I am told that purchasing the BlackBerry data plan unlocks this, but no one has yet even attempted to justify the fact that it is locked in the first place.



If everyone had to "do the research" like this, no one would every buy anything because by the time the research was complete, the item would be obsolete and no longer available.

Frustrating !!

~ j.

1. Justification?

The reason they do what they do is this..... $$$$$$$$$. The wireless business is a very shady business indeed. However, they can get away with charging excess taxes, termination fees, forcing you to pay for certain features to access applications on devices ect. How about the fact that they lock devices to their carriers? Think thats fair?

The fact is that there is little that you can do. If you want to play you have to pay. Simple as that. The companies control our phones, not us.

2. As for doing research, I always suggest it. Dig as much as possible. Because what happens is what everyone regrets, Buyers Remorse. While no one here wants to treat you with hostility, we too get frustrated when someone starts complaining that something wont work on their new device when they could have asked before they bought.


Good luck

The Gecko

[mak618]

While I understand the buyer's remorse part I totally agree with the rant. Here's a device that has the necessary hardware to connect and do things over wi-fi. Still locking it just so that the end user is forced to use the slow data connection over EDGE does not make any sense.

I agree that its the carriers who market the device here in the US but its the manufacturer who puts these locks in place. Think about the potential that this phone has but is just wasted due to these restrictions.

Dont get me wrong, this is a great phone but its these limitations that beat the logic and am sure are the cause of all the frustration.

BTW for Jay, in case you are looking to use the curve for accessing email primarily over wi-fi look for the lates build of LogicMail. That allows uses to select if they want to connect over wi-fi. It works like a charm (you don't even have to configure the tcp connection parameters needed on the regular LogicMail app)

Good Luck

[gth2j]

Has anyone besides eawmhr successfully get 3rd party applications to work by calling up T-Mobile?

I've talked to 3 different T-mobile bb support people and they all did the same thing: resend whatever service books they had, told me T-Mobile doesn't support 3rd party, and I will need a data plan to access any of those applications. When I asked to speak to someone higher up, they all insisted that they don't support 3rd party and the conversation pretty much ended there.

[John Clark]

The reason I don't agree with the rant is that the 8320 does what it says it does. It will connect to the internet via a wifi connection and the built in wifi browser. It will do this without even a sim card installed. However, it costs money to get the premium services like push email, pin messaging, and, because it's quite new, the 3rd party apps are still being written to take advantage of the wifi connection.

It's too bad that this member has buyers remorse. I don't wish that on anyone. However, it's not RIM's fault and it's not the BB's fault. It is more likely to be the carrier's fault for not having knowledgable sales people giving accurate info about the device.

Originally Posted by mak618

While I understand the buyer's remorse part I totally agree with the rant. Here's a device that has the necessary hardware to connect and do things over wi-fi. Still locking it just so that the end user is forced to use the slow data connection over EDGE does not make any sense.

I agree that its the carriers who market the device here in the US but its the manufacturer who puts these locks in place. Think about the potential that this phone has but is just wasted due to these restrictions.

Dont get me wrong, this is a great phone but its these limitations that beat the logic and am sure are the cause of all the frustration.

BTW for Jay, in case you are looking to use the curve for accessing email primarily over wi-fi look for the lates build of LogicMail. That allows uses to select if they want to connect over wi-fi. It works like a charm (you don't even have to configure the tcp connection parameters needed on the regular LogicMail app)

Good Luck

[makedonce]

I'm T-mobile Macedonia and they DON'T offer BB plans, so i just use regular data and wifi for my 8320.
So far, here is a list of apps that manage to work over wi-fi

JiveTalk
BB Browser
Google Docs
Google Maps
Google News
Google Search

The following 3rd party apps require generic data plan:
Gmail
Google Sync
Google mobile updater
Jmirc
Viigo
I know that someone folks have gotten Jmirc over Wi-fi, i cant seem to do it.
Also, if anyone figures out if gmail can run over wi-fi please let me know.
I cant do the service books shenanigan as T-mobile doest not offer BB plans.
Thanks

[XtasyX]

I recently got the 8320 off eBay. After reading this thread, i tried the programs that i do need/want and see if it'll work. I am using this phone on Rogers Wireless Network without a data plan.

I turned off voice and only running on Wifi and these are my results:
Google Maps: No
BBMaps: No
GMail: No
Opera Mini 4.0: No
Facebook: No
Windows Live Messenger: No
AOL: No
Gtalk: No
ICQ: No
Yahoo: No
BBWeather: No
BBMessenger: No

LogicMail: Yes
BBBrowser: Yes
BBToday: Yes

As stated in this thread, I believe the only way to get No into Yes would require the service books. Will try to get the service book using my friend's BB Data and report back.

[XtasyX]

Ok, so i borrowed my friend's sim card today which has BB Data and i loaded most of these programs (i was in a rush) to get the service book or whatever was needed from BB data to run these programs. I then swapped my sim card back in which DOES NOT have BB data and have WAP disabled through Rogers and these are my new results:

BBMaps: No (Rim Feature)
BBMessenger: No (RIM Feature)
Facebook: No (RIM Feature)
GMail: No (Didn't try, forgot to)
*Windows Live Messenger: No (Apparently my device doesn't support this...)
*AOL: No (Apparently my device doesn't support this...)
*Gtalk: No (Apparently my device doesn't support this...)
*ICQ: No (Apparently my device doesn't support this...)
*Yahoo: No (Apparently my device doesn't support this...)

JiveTalk: Really wierd, didn't work with and without data...i get some tunnel error. I think it's the settings or something, will play around with it next time i get to borrow the sim again.

Canadian Business: Yes (Just added and still works)
Yahoo! Go: Yes (Just added and still works)
Opera Mini 4.0: Yes
BBWeather: Yes
Google Maps: Yes (has some pin-point thing which acts like GPS - really cool)
LogicMail: Yes
BBBrowser: Yes
BBToday: Yes

*For some reason, i went to http://www.blackberry.com/livemessenger to get the service books and it said my BB doesn't support this application, even though it came with the phone... have no idea why this happened.

I also downloaded Circle Popper, Sudoku, Lingo, Ka-Glom!, Handmark Blackjack, Outbreak Control off http://mobile.blackberry.com > Free Games and they all work without data.

Any programs you guys would like me to try?

[avmsam]

i am with rogers in canada. i see u guys talking about getting data plan for a day to get the service books so that apps can use wifi. can i do this with rogers? if so what are the steps? get data plan... call provider for service books or do they come automatically.. then cancel and PRESTO... apps can use wifi

[heislord5]

I think this is worthy of a lawsuit.

The fact that they are holding back these service books show intent to defraud customers. Why not just send the exact same set of service books to everyone so everything works for everyone? Why not allow everyone to use their Wifi?


I mean, gosh, IF YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE BROWSING USING THEIR NETWORK, BUT IT IS ONLY USED TO ESTABLISH THE INITIAL CONNECTION, WHY SCREW THE CUSTOMER?

I'm trying to browse through wifi....instead of doing the right thing and enabling everything to establish their connections....its just like...hehehe....lets see how we can screw the customer.

[avelasqu]

Originally Posted by LunkHead

I had to cancel my data plan (long story) but in the process have been playing with the BB... Here is what I have discovered thus far... I know this might be old knowledge to many but figured I'd start a thread incase others are interested

I can connect to UMA / Wi-Fi with no issues.... I had T-Mo add what is called a BlackBerry Feature Enabler (see this thread: http://www.blackberryforums.com/wifi...abler-uma.html)

1. BBMessenger does not work even via Wi-Fi (you will need a data plan)

2. BBWeather will connect and update via the Wi-Fi connection

3. PDSports will connect and update via the Wi-Fi connection

4. Beyond411 will connect and search via the Wi-Fi connection

5. I can surf the net using the Wi-Fi browser as long as I am connectd to Wi-Fi

That is all I have discovered thus far....

Kris

How would I get apps like Google apps, BB Weather and mostly the ones you mentioned without a data plan? I have to get to the internet to get them first and I am stuck. I thought even with wifi there was no way to surf or check gmail... what am i missing here. and I do have the enabler added on.